WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.530 Okay, we're live. Hi everybody. 00:00:02.530 --> 00:00:03.200 Morning. This is Dave Weiner. 00:00:03.200 --> 00:00:04.160 It's morning coffee notes 00:00:04.160 --> 00:00:06.080 coming to you from 42nd Street 00:00:06.080 --> 00:00:07.240 in New York, New York 00:00:07.240 --> 00:00:09.090 I'm here with Mike. Mike, what 00:00:09.090 --> 00:00:10.520 's your last name? Uh, Colchini. 00:00:10.520 --> 00:00:12.370 Say that again? Colchini. Colch 00:00:12.370 --> 00:00:14.700 ini. Mike is the editor of H 00:00:14.700 --> 00:00:15.800 acking Netflix 00:00:15.800 --> 00:00:17.850 Weblog, a very excellent weblog 00:00:17.850 --> 00:00:19.780 that has just like huge flow. 00:00:19.780 --> 00:00:22.750 So if you ever want to get some 00:00:22.750 --> 00:00:23.600 flow for your blog 00:00:24.480 --> 00:00:25.950 You got to grevel to Mike and 00:00:25.950 --> 00:00:27.660 maybe he'll point to you. And 00:00:27.660 --> 00:00:29.270 then Ryan, Ryan, what's your 00:00:29.270 --> 00:00:30.600 last name? Sigir. 00:00:30.600 --> 00:00:34.160 Okay, and I'm not gonna try 00:00:34.160 --> 00:00:36.200 that. You guys, you, oh anyway, 00:00:36.200 --> 00:00:37.680 so how did we all meet? 00:00:37.680 --> 00:00:40.010 Steve Rebell who has the micro 00:00:40.010 --> 00:00:42.550 persuasion blog, he's stuck on 00:00:42.550 --> 00:00:44.450 a train on his way into Grand 00:00:44.450 --> 00:00:45.800 Central Station and 00:00:45.800 --> 00:00:48.240 he's gonna call 00:00:48.240 --> 00:00:50.400 sometime soon and 00:00:50.400 --> 00:00:52.250 he'll join us and in the 00:00:52.250 --> 00:00:52.800 meantime 00:00:53.880 --> 00:00:55.800 What should we talk about? 00:00:55.800 --> 00:00:57.340 What's, you're a blogger, right 00:00:57.340 --> 00:00:59.240 ? Yeah, we're all three of us 00:00:59.240 --> 00:01:00.650 are bloggers. So I know what 00:01:00.650 --> 00:01:02.240 his blog is about. What's yours 00:01:02.240 --> 00:01:02.520 about? 00:01:02.520 --> 00:01:04.560 It's orbicast with all things 00:01:04.560 --> 00:01:06.700 satellite radio. Oh cool. Cover 00:01:06.700 --> 00:01:07.720 Sirius XM. 00:01:07.720 --> 00:01:10.620 Are you interested? Do you have 00:01:10.620 --> 00:01:11.400 an interest in satellite radio? 00:01:11.400 --> 00:01:12.240 Oh, yeah. 00:01:12.240 --> 00:01:15.150 Sort of a crazy little passion. 00:01:15.150 --> 00:01:15.640 Is that right? Yeah. 00:01:15.640 --> 00:01:18.800 So how long have you been doing 00:01:18.800 --> 00:01:21.880 it? Since late October actually 00:01:21.880 --> 00:01:21.920 . 00:01:23.680 --> 00:01:25.220 It's taken off like crazy. It's 00:01:25.220 --> 00:01:26.380 just that it's amazing that a 00:01:26.380 --> 00:01:27.290 number of people that really 00:01:27.290 --> 00:01:28.880 want to, they're hungry for 00:01:28.880 --> 00:01:29.440 information on it. 00:01:29.440 --> 00:01:30.380 Is that right? So do you like 00:01:30.380 --> 00:01:31.520 get them information on that? 00:01:31.520 --> 00:01:32.360 Oh, yeah, it's like 00:01:32.360 --> 00:01:35.010 constantly all day long and 00:01:35.010 --> 00:01:35.360 that's pretty much what I'm 00:01:35.360 --> 00:01:36.070 doing. Is that right? Oh, you 00:01:36.070 --> 00:01:37.080 see like you don't have a day 00:01:37.080 --> 00:01:37.920 job, that's your job? 00:01:37.920 --> 00:01:40.400 No, I don't have a day job. 00:01:40.400 --> 00:01:41.160 Yeah, cause you lost it, should 00:01:41.160 --> 00:01:42.320 you leave it all day long? No, 00:01:42.320 --> 00:01:42.640 no, no, no. 00:01:42.640 --> 00:01:45.290 All these people in here, we're 00:01:45.290 --> 00:01:47.150 in a starbomb, sorry, all these 00:01:47.150 --> 00:01:48.080 people are staring at us 00:01:48.080 --> 00:01:49.500 wondering, well, maybe these 00:01:49.500 --> 00:01:51.080 are like a big-time radio show 00:01:51.080 --> 00:01:51.600 or something. 00:01:52.200 --> 00:01:54.350 It's just a podcast. I love 00:01:54.350 --> 00:01:55.460 this setup. So, yeah. Oh, well, 00:01:55.460 --> 00:01:56.470 tell them about it. What do you 00:01:56.470 --> 00:01:57.320 see? What does it look like to 00:01:57.320 --> 00:01:57.560 you? 00:01:57.560 --> 00:01:59.060 So, this is like a little 00:01:59.060 --> 00:01:59.760 conference 00:01:59.760 --> 00:02:02.100 conference microphone. Yeah, it 00:02:02.100 --> 00:02:03.120 's like designed for a 00:02:03.120 --> 00:02:04.530 conference room table. So you 00:02:04.530 --> 00:02:07.980 get the 360. It's sort of like 00:02:07.980 --> 00:02:08.440 a dingus. 00:02:08.440 --> 00:02:11.920 It's got a radius. I'll, maybe 00:02:11.920 --> 00:02:12.960 I'll put a picture of this up 00:02:12.960 --> 00:02:15.440 here, but it sort of projects 00:02:15.440 --> 00:02:16.520 up and down. 00:02:16.520 --> 00:02:18.540 So, actually, it would be kind 00:02:18.540 --> 00:02:20.270 of better if it was like maybe 00:02:20.270 --> 00:02:22.110 10 inches. So should we just 00:02:22.110 --> 00:02:22.680 lower it? 00:02:22.680 --> 00:02:23.840 But it doesn't, actually, maybe 00:02:23.840 --> 00:02:25.560 that would be better, but see, 00:02:25.560 --> 00:02:27.120 here's the, you can see the 00:02:27.120 --> 00:02:28.440 graph there, right? 00:02:28.440 --> 00:02:29.650 So it's picking up my voice 00:02:29.650 --> 00:02:30.890 pretty well. You can say 00:02:30.890 --> 00:02:33.060 something. Oh, hey. A little 00:02:33.060 --> 00:02:34.560 bit. Yeah, see, there you go. 00:02:34.560 --> 00:02:36.440 So, tell us about hacking 00:02:36.440 --> 00:02:38.480 Netflix. What's that like? 00:02:38.480 --> 00:02:42.040 It's been interesting. I 00:02:42.040 --> 00:02:44.990 don't know. I've been doing 00:02:44.990 --> 00:02:45.870 this almost a year and a half 00:02:45.870 --> 00:02:46.040 and 00:02:46.560 --> 00:02:47.780 it's kind of surprised me where 00:02:47.780 --> 00:02:49.280 it's gone. Yeah, it's 00:02:49.280 --> 00:02:51.300 well, it was a deliberate thing 00:02:51.300 --> 00:02:53.210 on your part. You wanted to 00:02:53.210 --> 00:02:55.050 make a blog that would have a 00:02:55.050 --> 00:02:55.480 large 00:02:55.480 --> 00:02:57.460 audience or a lot of people 00:02:57.460 --> 00:02:58.560 meeting it. 00:02:58.560 --> 00:03:01.640 Actually, I didn't. 00:03:01.640 --> 00:03:03.240 It's just what it was. It was 00:03:03.240 --> 00:03:05.050 the Monday. The Monday release 00:03:05.050 --> 00:03:06.040 is what's new. 00:03:06.040 --> 00:03:07.970 Yeah, it was news. I actually 00:03:07.970 --> 00:03:09.550 wanted to explore what was 00:03:09.550 --> 00:03:11.160 going on with Netflix. 00:03:11.160 --> 00:03:12.190 They're a very private company 00:03:12.190 --> 00:03:13.120 and I sort of want to hack the 00:03:13.120 --> 00:03:14.080 company, you know, sort of 00:03:14.080 --> 00:03:15.160 figure out what's going on. 00:03:15.160 --> 00:03:18.160 It's a stupid domain name. 00:03:18.160 --> 00:03:20.160 It's a great domain name. 00:03:20.160 --> 00:03:21.800 I criticized it from day one on 00:03:21.800 --> 00:03:22.160 it. 00:03:22.160 --> 00:03:24.160 Why? What's wrong with it? 00:03:24.160 --> 00:03:26.160 Well, it sounds like amateur. 00:03:26.160 --> 00:03:27.720 She's really like hacking 00:03:27.720 --> 00:03:29.160 Netflix. What does that mean? 00:03:29.160 --> 00:03:30.990 Well, it's like rocking Netflix 00:03:30.990 --> 00:03:32.190 , but in the 21st century. 00:03:32.190 --> 00:03:33.160 Exactly. 00:03:33.160 --> 00:03:37.160 How's Netflix doing? 00:03:37.160 --> 00:03:38.410 They're doing really well. They 00:03:38.410 --> 00:03:40.200 just announced that they passed 00:03:40.200 --> 00:03:41.160 the 3 million subscriber mark 00:03:41.160 --> 00:03:42.420 based on the competition from 00:03:42.420 --> 00:03:43.160 Blockbuster. 00:03:43.160 --> 00:03:44.880 They're still managing to grow 00:03:44.880 --> 00:03:46.200 despite pretty hardcore 00:03:46.200 --> 00:03:47.160 competition. 00:03:47.160 --> 00:03:48.560 Blockbuster is spending a ton 00:03:48.560 --> 00:03:49.610 of money acquiring new 00:03:49.610 --> 00:03:51.430 customers and Netflix is still 00:03:51.430 --> 00:03:52.160 growing. 00:03:52.160 --> 00:03:53.680 I haven't switched. I still use 00:03:53.680 --> 00:03:55.440 Netflix. I tend to be pretty 00:03:55.440 --> 00:03:56.860 loyal. I think the service is 00:03:56.860 --> 00:03:57.160 good. 00:03:57.160 --> 00:03:59.080 I know I've read on some other 00:03:59.080 --> 00:04:01.190 blogs like John Robb has a blog 00:04:01.190 --> 00:04:03.660 where he basically said Netflix 00:04:03.660 --> 00:04:04.160 's toast that they can't. 00:04:04.160 --> 00:04:07.160 The turnaround is very bad now. 00:04:07.160 --> 00:04:08.920 They had some problems in early 00:04:08.920 --> 00:04:10.670 January, February, and it's 00:04:10.670 --> 00:04:12.410 part of their... they go 00:04:12.410 --> 00:04:14.160 through prosperits. 00:04:14.160 --> 00:04:15.060 And when you had that many 00:04:15.060 --> 00:04:16.210 members, you do have some movie 00:04:16.210 --> 00:04:17.460 allocation problems, but I'm 00:04:17.460 --> 00:04:18.820 hearing double the problems 00:04:18.820 --> 00:04:20.160 from Blockbuster right now. 00:04:20.160 --> 00:04:21.440 Of course. Start-up must be 00:04:21.440 --> 00:04:22.650 like, yeah. Have you ever 00:04:22.650 --> 00:04:23.610 actually seen an Netflix 00:04:23.610 --> 00:04:24.160 facility? 00:04:24.160 --> 00:04:25.660 No, no. They've actually 00:04:25.660 --> 00:04:27.160 invited me out, though. 00:04:27.160 --> 00:04:28.580 They have one in New York, don 00:04:28.580 --> 00:04:29.160 't they? 00:04:29.160 --> 00:04:31.160 There's one in Queens. 00:04:31.160 --> 00:04:32.160 In Flushing. 00:04:32.160 --> 00:04:33.500 Yeah, and I'm actually in Flus 00:04:33.500 --> 00:04:34.860 hing every once in a while, but 00:04:34.860 --> 00:04:36.160 they're very secretive. 00:04:36.160 --> 00:04:37.370 They've only released a few 00:04:37.370 --> 00:04:38.590 photos of the distribution 00:04:38.590 --> 00:04:39.160 centers. 00:04:39.160 --> 00:04:40.900 Really? But you could go inside 00:04:40.900 --> 00:04:41.710 and take a look at the view 00:04:41.710 --> 00:04:42.900 monitor. They invited you to do 00:04:42.900 --> 00:04:43.160 that? 00:04:43.160 --> 00:04:44.660 Well, they invited me to the 00:04:44.660 --> 00:04:46.160 corporate headquarters. 00:04:46.160 --> 00:04:48.470 So there's something... some 00:04:48.470 --> 00:04:49.610 secret sauce inside that 00:04:49.610 --> 00:04:51.160 distribution center, huh? 00:04:51.160 --> 00:04:52.050 Well, they're starting to 00:04:52.050 --> 00:04:53.160 release information about it, 00:04:53.160 --> 00:04:54.190 so they've shown actual 00:04:54.190 --> 00:04:55.630 pictures of people stuffing the 00:04:55.630 --> 00:04:57.160 envelopes and things like that. 00:04:57.160 --> 00:04:58.460 They kind of visualized what it 00:04:58.460 --> 00:04:59.160 must be like. 00:04:59.160 --> 00:05:00.460 Somebody was telling me, maybe 00:05:00.460 --> 00:05:01.830 it was you, that they have some 00:05:01.830 --> 00:05:02.820 kind of deal with the post 00:05:02.820 --> 00:05:03.160 office, 00:05:03.160 --> 00:05:05.080 so that when you return the 00:05:05.080 --> 00:05:07.170 envelope, it scans it at the 00:05:07.170 --> 00:05:09.200 post office, and that goes on 00:05:09.200 --> 00:05:10.160 their computer, 00:05:10.160 --> 00:05:11.720 and they send you something out 00:05:11.720 --> 00:05:13.040 , a new one out, before it 00:05:13.040 --> 00:05:14.160 actually arrives. 00:05:14.160 --> 00:05:15.160 Well, actually... 00:05:15.160 --> 00:05:16.160 Is that true, or...? 00:05:16.160 --> 00:05:17.280 From what I understand, it's 00:05:17.280 --> 00:05:18.160 currently not true. 00:05:18.160 --> 00:05:19.560 I think they've tested it in 00:05:19.560 --> 00:05:20.160 the past. 00:05:20.160 --> 00:05:20.940 Blockbuster is supposedly doing 00:05:20.940 --> 00:05:22.160 that. It's wrecking havoc. 00:05:22.160 --> 00:05:23.240 I've got people that are 00:05:23.240 --> 00:05:24.550 recording five movies out of 00:05:24.550 --> 00:05:26.160 the three-hour plan right now. 00:05:26.160 --> 00:05:27.370 Because they're erroneous 00:05:27.370 --> 00:05:28.800 positives, or something like 00:05:28.800 --> 00:05:29.160 that. 00:05:29.160 --> 00:05:30.770 Yeah, they're getting the movie 00:05:30.770 --> 00:05:32.130 scan, so we're seeing all kinds 00:05:32.130 --> 00:05:33.160 of weirdness going on. 00:05:33.160 --> 00:05:34.440 But from what I understand, the 00:05:34.440 --> 00:05:35.650 source of Netflix, they don't 00:05:35.650 --> 00:05:36.160 do that. 00:05:36.160 --> 00:05:37.080 So it seems like it must be, 00:05:37.080 --> 00:05:38.160 like, a temporary... 00:05:38.160 --> 00:05:40.400 This whole idea of mailing 00:05:40.400 --> 00:05:43.160 around these DVDs, you know, 00:05:43.160 --> 00:05:44.590 seems like a sort of an anach 00:05:44.590 --> 00:05:46.160 ronistic thing 00:05:46.160 --> 00:05:47.710 that, given a few more years, 00:05:47.710 --> 00:05:49.160 it'll all be networked. 00:05:49.160 --> 00:05:50.890 This is... Steve, I gotta get 00:05:50.890 --> 00:05:52.160 it. Hold on. 00:05:52.160 --> 00:05:53.560 Why don't you...? Oh, whatever. 00:05:53.560 --> 00:05:54.160 Steve, how you doing? 00:05:54.160 --> 00:05:56.160 Okay. 00:05:56.160 --> 00:05:59.160 Okay, we're... Do you know...? 00:05:59.160 --> 00:06:00.920 We're live reporting Steve Ra 00:06:00.920 --> 00:06:01.160 vel. 00:06:01.160 --> 00:06:04.160 Hold on. 00:06:04.160 --> 00:06:05.880 Dave's leaving, so maybe I'll 00:06:05.880 --> 00:06:07.710 read and address his first 00:06:07.710 --> 00:06:08.160 question. 00:06:08.160 --> 00:06:09.490 I started the blog, since he 00:06:09.490 --> 00:06:10.670 can't hear it, he won't be 00:06:10.670 --> 00:06:11.160 modest. 00:06:11.160 --> 00:06:13.360 I started the blog because we 00:06:13.360 --> 00:06:15.160 came from a software company, 00:06:15.160 --> 00:06:16.380 and I actually worked together 00:06:16.380 --> 00:06:17.160 a software company. 00:06:17.160 --> 00:06:17.850 You know, we're the global 00:06:17.850 --> 00:06:18.480 building, which used to be 00:06:18.480 --> 00:06:19.160 called the global building. 00:06:19.160 --> 00:06:21.050 Dave said to actually 00:06:21.050 --> 00:06:23.520 understand blogging, you should 00:06:23.520 --> 00:06:25.160 read 50 blogs and start one. 00:06:25.160 --> 00:06:26.570 And I just started wanting a 00:06:26.570 --> 00:06:28.160 company I'm passionate about, 00:06:28.160 --> 00:06:29.520 and I thought that was really 00:06:29.520 --> 00:06:32.080 important, you know, to learn 00:06:32.080 --> 00:06:33.160 blogging. 00:06:33.160 --> 00:06:34.500 And this is sort of the 00:06:34.500 --> 00:06:36.160 experiment going awry. 00:06:36.160 --> 00:06:38.140 It's sort of the automatic 00:06:38.140 --> 00:06:40.210 thing to want to talk to this 00:06:40.210 --> 00:06:41.160 microphone. 00:06:41.160 --> 00:06:43.060 This little stick just standing 00:06:43.060 --> 00:06:44.510 right on the table, and you 00:06:44.510 --> 00:06:45.160 have to look at it and talk to 00:06:45.160 --> 00:06:45.160 it. 00:06:45.160 --> 00:06:46.160 Yeah. 00:06:46.160 --> 00:06:48.160 Note your voice level. 00:06:48.160 --> 00:06:50.160 Okay, good. 00:06:50.160 --> 00:06:51.160 Good. 00:06:51.160 --> 00:06:52.810 So that was a little dramatic 00:06:52.810 --> 00:06:53.160 thing. 00:06:53.160 --> 00:06:55.560 Steve's in New York now, and 00:06:55.560 --> 00:06:58.160 Steve Ravel, PR blogger... 00:06:58.160 --> 00:07:00.160 PR God, yes. 00:07:00.160 --> 00:07:01.160 is going to be joining us soon. 00:07:01.160 --> 00:07:02.350 So what were you guys talking 00:07:02.350 --> 00:07:03.650 about while I was, otherwise, 00:07:03.650 --> 00:07:04.160 occupied? 00:07:04.160 --> 00:07:05.410 Oh, I readjusted your first 00:07:05.410 --> 00:07:08.160 question about why I started... 00:07:08.160 --> 00:07:10.160 Why I started hacking Netflix. 00:07:10.160 --> 00:07:10.770 I readjusted your first 00:07:10.770 --> 00:07:11.160 question. 00:07:11.160 --> 00:07:12.160 Oh, why did you do that? 00:07:12.160 --> 00:07:13.580 Because we came from a software 00:07:13.580 --> 00:07:14.160 company. 00:07:14.160 --> 00:07:14.790 There were a couple other 00:07:14.790 --> 00:07:15.160 people involved, 00:07:15.160 --> 00:07:16.650 so we started a software 00:07:16.650 --> 00:07:17.160 company that sold it to people 00:07:17.160 --> 00:07:17.160 here in New York. 00:07:17.160 --> 00:07:18.850 You guys used to work together 00:07:18.850 --> 00:07:19.160 then? 00:07:19.160 --> 00:07:20.160 Yeah, for years. 00:07:20.160 --> 00:07:21.160 Years. 00:07:21.160 --> 00:07:22.160 They're like your buddies. 00:07:22.160 --> 00:07:23.160 Yeah. 00:07:23.160 --> 00:07:24.700 And we encourage each other to 00:07:24.700 --> 00:07:26.160 blog and stuff like that. 00:07:26.160 --> 00:07:27.160 You only know something funny. 00:07:27.160 --> 00:07:28.780 We were sitting around at a 00:07:28.780 --> 00:07:30.160 meeting at my work now. 00:07:30.160 --> 00:07:30.910 You know how blogging has 00:07:30.910 --> 00:07:31.160 spread? 00:07:31.160 --> 00:07:32.480 It's sort of this person-to- 00:07:32.480 --> 00:07:33.790 person thing we were talking 00:07:33.790 --> 00:07:34.160 about, 00:07:34.160 --> 00:07:35.160 you know, spreading podcasts. 00:07:35.160 --> 00:07:36.620 Well, they don't know anything 00:07:36.620 --> 00:07:37.160 about it. 00:07:37.160 --> 00:07:39.160 Well, here's what I mean. 00:07:39.160 --> 00:07:40.160 See what I mean? 00:07:40.160 --> 00:07:41.160 Well, let me just say this. 00:07:41.160 --> 00:07:43.360 Before we started, I said, "Let 00:07:43.360 --> 00:07:44.160 's not do anything. 00:07:44.160 --> 00:07:45.580 Let's not talk at all, because 00:07:45.580 --> 00:07:46.910 it'll screw up the whole thing 00:07:46.910 --> 00:07:47.160 ." 00:07:47.160 --> 00:07:48.940 But unfortunately, yeah, we did 00:07:48.940 --> 00:07:49.160 . 00:07:49.160 --> 00:07:50.160 Well, no, no, no. 00:07:50.160 --> 00:07:50.750 What I'm saying is we were 00:07:50.750 --> 00:07:51.730 sitting around at a product 00:07:51.730 --> 00:07:52.160 manager meeting 00:07:52.160 --> 00:07:53.300 where we were talking about 00:07:53.300 --> 00:07:54.620 having another blog for our 00:07:54.620 --> 00:07:55.160 company. 00:07:55.160 --> 00:07:56.160 Right. 00:07:56.160 --> 00:07:57.160 Our CEO blogs. 00:07:57.160 --> 00:07:59.160 The guy next to me blogs. 00:07:59.160 --> 00:08:00.280 The guy across us has a blog 00:08:00.280 --> 00:08:01.160 for his youth group. 00:08:01.160 --> 00:08:02.550 And another guy has a blog he's 00:08:02.550 --> 00:08:03.990 starting up about New York City 00:08:03.990 --> 00:08:04.160 . 00:08:04.160 --> 00:08:05.430 So there's six bloggers and out 00:08:05.430 --> 00:08:06.160 of six people. 00:08:06.160 --> 00:08:07.160 What company is this? 00:08:07.160 --> 00:08:08.550 It's Indexed Stock Imagery in 00:08:08.550 --> 00:08:09.160 New York. 00:08:09.160 --> 00:08:11.160 It's a stock photo agency. 00:08:11.160 --> 00:08:12.160 Right, right. 00:08:12.160 --> 00:08:14.020 So blogging, it's fair to say 00:08:14.020 --> 00:08:15.160 it's caught on. 00:08:15.160 --> 00:08:16.160 Oh, yeah. 00:08:16.160 --> 00:08:17.430 And does anybody worry about 00:08:17.430 --> 00:08:18.590 how many people are reading 00:08:18.590 --> 00:08:19.160 their blogs? 00:08:19.160 --> 00:08:20.900 I don't, you know, I don't 00:08:20.900 --> 00:08:22.160 worry about it. 00:08:22.160 --> 00:08:23.160 I'd like to watch it. 00:08:23.160 --> 00:08:24.160 You worry about it. 00:08:24.160 --> 00:08:25.160 Well. 00:08:25.160 --> 00:08:26.160 Knacking Netflix. 00:08:26.160 --> 00:08:27.160 Hey, there he is. 00:08:27.160 --> 00:08:28.160 Steve. 00:08:28.160 --> 00:08:29.160 Steveville. 00:08:29.160 --> 00:08:30.160 Say hi to the folks at home. 00:08:30.160 --> 00:08:31.160 Hello, everyone. 00:08:31.160 --> 00:08:32.160 I... 00:08:32.160 --> 00:08:33.160 What's your name? 00:08:33.160 --> 00:08:34.160 My name is Steve Herbell. 00:08:34.160 --> 00:08:35.160 What's the name of your blog? 00:08:35.160 --> 00:08:36.380 My name and my blog is Micro 00:08:36.380 --> 00:08:37.160 Persuasion. 00:08:37.160 --> 00:08:38.800 But doesn't everybody know that 00:08:38.800 --> 00:08:39.160 already? 00:08:39.160 --> 00:08:40.160 Not everybody. 00:08:40.160 --> 00:08:41.250 There must be somebody who 00:08:41.250 --> 00:08:42.160 doesn't know that. 00:08:42.160 --> 00:08:42.860 So Steve, you're going to get 00:08:42.860 --> 00:08:43.160 ... 00:08:43.160 --> 00:08:44.160 Oh, you found this? 00:08:44.160 --> 00:08:45.160 Yeah. 00:08:45.160 --> 00:08:46.210 Well, that's a sexy backpack 00:08:46.210 --> 00:08:47.160 you're talking about. 00:08:47.160 --> 00:08:48.160 Thank you. 00:08:48.160 --> 00:08:49.160 I have to be different. 00:08:49.160 --> 00:08:50.160 I have to be different. 00:08:50.160 --> 00:08:50.900 So you're going to get some 00:08:50.900 --> 00:08:51.160 coffee? 00:08:51.160 --> 00:08:52.160 I am. 00:08:52.160 --> 00:08:53.160 Yes. 00:08:53.160 --> 00:08:54.160 Okay. 00:08:54.160 --> 00:08:55.160 We'll be ready for you. 00:08:55.160 --> 00:08:55.920 I'll have a question ready for 00:08:55.920 --> 00:08:56.160 you. 00:08:56.160 --> 00:08:57.160 Oh, okay. 00:08:57.160 --> 00:08:58.160 That's not good. 00:08:58.160 --> 00:08:59.160 Nice surprise, Steve. 00:08:59.160 --> 00:09:00.380 That was Steve Rebell, 00:09:00.380 --> 00:09:01.160 everybody. 00:09:01.160 --> 00:09:02.160 Everybody. 00:09:02.160 --> 00:09:04.130 So everybody at your company at 00:09:04.130 --> 00:09:06.310 this meeting, they all have 00:09:06.310 --> 00:09:07.160 blogs. 00:09:07.160 --> 00:09:08.160 Oh, yeah. 00:09:08.160 --> 00:09:09.160 One of them is interesting. 00:09:09.160 --> 00:09:11.160 It's called Garage Spin. 00:09:11.160 --> 00:09:12.160 What? 00:09:12.160 --> 00:09:13.160 Garage Spin. 00:09:13.160 --> 00:09:14.940 I've talked to a lot of people 00:09:14.940 --> 00:09:16.160 about blogging. 00:09:16.160 --> 00:09:16.870 I've talked to people on the 00:09:16.870 --> 00:09:17.160 train. 00:09:17.160 --> 00:09:18.700 I've done presentations of blog 00:09:18.700 --> 00:09:19.160 ging now. 00:09:19.160 --> 00:09:21.160 He's a musician. 00:09:21.160 --> 00:09:24.160 He wants to record an album. 00:09:24.160 --> 00:09:27.090 When I talked to him, he didn't 00:09:27.090 --> 00:09:30.160 know how to market his album. 00:09:30.160 --> 00:09:32.410 So I told him, "Blog the 00:09:32.410 --> 00:09:33.160 process. 00:09:33.160 --> 00:09:34.160 Blog the tools you use. 00:09:34.160 --> 00:09:35.300 Blog the thing that you're 00:09:35.300 --> 00:09:36.160 going through." 00:09:36.160 --> 00:09:37.160 I want to learn about it. 00:09:37.160 --> 00:09:38.160 And he's crossing the podcast. 00:09:38.160 --> 00:09:40.820 I've been pushing him very hard 00:09:40.820 --> 00:09:41.160 . 00:09:41.160 --> 00:09:42.160 I'm like, "Dude, podcast. 00:09:42.160 --> 00:09:44.730 This is a beautiful outlet, 00:09:44.730 --> 00:09:47.260 especially for the masses of 00:09:47.260 --> 00:09:48.160 people who just want to be 00:09:48.160 --> 00:09:49.480 musicians and want to have 00:09:49.480 --> 00:09:50.160 exposure. 00:09:50.160 --> 00:09:51.160 That's podcasting. 00:09:51.160 --> 00:09:53.650 You can just instantly just 00:09:53.650 --> 00:09:55.160 deliver all your... 00:09:55.160 --> 00:09:56.160 So do you do it? 00:09:56.160 --> 00:09:57.160 Yeah. 00:09:57.160 --> 00:09:58.160 Garage Spin's up and running. 00:09:58.160 --> 00:09:59.160 Yeah. 00:09:59.160 --> 00:10:00.160 He's working on the blog. 00:10:00.160 --> 00:10:01.600 He's one of the people that's 00:10:01.600 --> 00:10:03.220 really concerned about how much 00:10:03.220 --> 00:10:04.480 traffic is coming in or 00:10:04.480 --> 00:10:05.160 whatever. 00:10:05.160 --> 00:10:07.950 I think everyone who's starting 00:10:07.950 --> 00:10:10.160 off just wants to know. 00:10:10.160 --> 00:10:11.280 Is there an audience to what I 00:10:11.280 --> 00:10:12.160 'm talking about? 00:10:12.160 --> 00:10:13.420 I don't think it's true of 00:10:13.420 --> 00:10:14.160 everybody. 00:10:14.160 --> 00:10:16.470 My father, for example, he's a 00:10:16.470 --> 00:10:18.160 very talkative guy. 00:10:18.160 --> 00:10:19.650 It's really hard to get a word 00:10:19.650 --> 00:10:20.160 in it. 00:10:20.160 --> 00:10:21.830 But he said, "I have nothing to 00:10:21.830 --> 00:10:22.160 say. 00:10:22.160 --> 00:10:23.160 What would I say?" 00:10:23.160 --> 00:10:24.160 That you hear a lot. 00:10:24.160 --> 00:10:25.160 It's like, "I don't know. 00:10:25.160 --> 00:10:26.860 I wouldn't have anything to say 00:10:26.860 --> 00:10:27.160 ." 00:10:27.160 --> 00:10:29.200 And so my answer to that is, " 00:10:29.200 --> 00:10:30.160 Well, just..." 00:10:30.160 --> 00:10:31.570 And those people are certainly 00:10:31.570 --> 00:10:32.760 not worried about how many 00:10:32.760 --> 00:10:34.160 people are going to read their 00:10:34.160 --> 00:10:35.160 blog. 00:10:35.160 --> 00:10:36.670 Their concern is the other end 00:10:36.670 --> 00:10:38.110 of it, is that all of a sudden 00:10:38.110 --> 00:10:39.520 everybody's going to be reading 00:10:39.520 --> 00:10:41.250 my blog and I'm not going to 00:10:41.250 --> 00:10:42.160 look good. 00:10:42.160 --> 00:10:43.160 I'm really stupid, right? 00:10:43.160 --> 00:10:44.160 That's true. 00:10:44.160 --> 00:10:45.420 So what I say to people like 00:10:45.420 --> 00:10:46.830 that is I say, "Well, just go 00:10:46.830 --> 00:10:48.160 ahead and start the blog and 00:10:48.160 --> 00:10:49.850 post something really, really 00:10:49.850 --> 00:10:51.160 insipid and stupid." 00:10:51.160 --> 00:10:52.810 It's like, "Hi, this is my blog 00:10:52.810 --> 00:10:53.160 ." 00:10:53.160 --> 00:10:54.960 And then just don't do anything 00:10:54.960 --> 00:10:55.160 . 00:10:55.160 --> 00:10:56.160 Leave alone. 00:10:56.160 --> 00:10:58.320 And then someday you'll be in 00:10:58.320 --> 00:11:00.570 the shower and an idea will hit 00:11:00.570 --> 00:11:01.160 you. 00:11:01.160 --> 00:11:03.450 And you'll go, "Oh, God, I wish 00:11:03.450 --> 00:11:05.160 I could just get this out to 00:11:05.160 --> 00:11:06.160 the world." 00:11:06.160 --> 00:11:07.310 And then that's when you go 00:11:07.310 --> 00:11:08.630 post something on your blog, 00:11:08.630 --> 00:11:09.160 right? 00:11:09.160 --> 00:11:10.270 And that sort of gets the 00:11:10.270 --> 00:11:11.160 process going. 00:11:11.160 --> 00:11:12.000 And that really has helped a 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:12.160 lot. 00:11:12.160 --> 00:11:13.910 I've found a lot of people sort 00:11:13.910 --> 00:11:15.590 of get over the first initial 00:11:15.590 --> 00:11:16.160 hump. 00:11:16.160 --> 00:11:18.160 But if you have to... 00:11:18.160 --> 00:11:20.230 It's sort of like, what's a 00:11:20.230 --> 00:11:22.130 good way writers get this 00:11:22.130 --> 00:11:24.160 question all the time? 00:11:24.160 --> 00:11:25.330 It's like, "Okay, I want to 00:11:25.330 --> 00:11:26.160 write something. 00:11:26.160 --> 00:11:28.160 How do I go about doing it?" 00:11:28.160 --> 00:11:29.490 And a writer will say, "Just 00:11:29.490 --> 00:11:30.160 write it." 00:11:30.160 --> 00:11:31.840 The only way to write is to 00:11:31.840 --> 00:11:33.160 actually write. 00:11:33.160 --> 00:11:35.160 You can't prepare to write. 00:11:35.160 --> 00:11:36.010 Same thing is true with podcast 00:11:36.010 --> 00:11:36.160 ing. 00:11:36.160 --> 00:11:38.330 So you were saying before, you 00:11:38.330 --> 00:11:39.950 're worried about the production 00:11:39.950 --> 00:11:40.160 . 00:11:40.160 --> 00:11:42.070 That, to me, is the same kind 00:11:42.070 --> 00:11:44.160 of concern that my father had. 00:11:44.160 --> 00:11:45.560 He said, "Well, I'm afraid I 00:11:45.560 --> 00:11:47.160 don't have anything to say." 00:11:47.160 --> 00:11:49.230 Well, the thing is that the 00:11:49.230 --> 00:11:51.340 good news is the first time you 00:11:51.340 --> 00:11:52.160 do a podcast, 00:11:52.160 --> 00:11:52.920 nobody's gonna listen to it 00:11:52.920 --> 00:11:53.160 anyway. 00:11:53.160 --> 00:11:55.160 So what's the problem? 00:11:55.160 --> 00:11:56.890 Look as bad as you want to look 00:11:56.890 --> 00:11:57.160 . 00:11:57.160 --> 00:11:59.160 I listened to my first podcast. 00:11:59.160 --> 00:12:01.160 It's pretty embarrassing. 00:12:01.160 --> 00:12:04.160 I pause at this moment and say, 00:12:04.160 --> 00:12:05.790 "Well, gosh, I think I better 00:12:05.790 --> 00:12:07.160 explain what I'm doing here." 00:12:07.160 --> 00:12:09.630 And then, without any segue at 00:12:09.630 --> 00:12:11.410 all, after I'm finished 00:12:11.410 --> 00:12:13.160 explaining what I'm doing, 00:12:13.160 --> 00:12:15.350 I just start reading from my 00:12:15.350 --> 00:12:16.160 notes. 00:12:16.160 --> 00:12:17.960 It's like, "Oh, I'm getting my 00:12:17.960 --> 00:12:19.160 picture taken." 00:12:19.160 --> 00:12:21.400 So anyway, Steve Rubell, who 00:12:21.400 --> 00:12:23.160 actually looks different from 00:12:23.160 --> 00:12:23.160 the way... 00:12:23.160 --> 00:12:24.590 I mean, you look the same, but 00:12:24.590 --> 00:12:25.940 you look different from what 00:12:25.940 --> 00:12:27.160 you look on your blog. 00:12:27.160 --> 00:12:28.610 Whether I look better online or 00:12:28.610 --> 00:12:29.160 ... 00:12:29.160 --> 00:12:30.160 There's no better... 00:12:30.160 --> 00:12:31.160 I'm not saying better or worse. 00:12:31.160 --> 00:12:32.160 It's just different. 00:12:32.160 --> 00:12:33.850 Steve has this big picture of 00:12:33.850 --> 00:12:35.380 himself right there in the 00:12:35.380 --> 00:12:36.160 upper corner, 00:12:36.160 --> 00:12:37.600 which probably is good PR, 00:12:37.600 --> 00:12:38.160 right? 00:12:38.160 --> 00:12:39.160 I guess so. 00:12:39.160 --> 00:12:41.380 So tell us about your blog and 00:12:41.380 --> 00:12:42.690 how you got started blogging, 00:12:42.690 --> 00:12:43.160 Steve. 00:12:43.160 --> 00:12:45.160 When did you start? 00:12:45.160 --> 00:12:46.160 MicroPersuasion? 00:12:46.160 --> 00:12:47.160 Is that the URL? 00:12:47.160 --> 00:12:49.160 Yes, it's micropersuasion.com. 00:12:49.160 --> 00:12:50.160 Okay. 00:12:50.160 --> 00:12:52.410 I would say about a year and a 00:12:52.410 --> 00:12:54.600 half ago, I started to read 00:12:54.600 --> 00:12:57.150 blogs aggressively through RSS 00:12:57.150 --> 00:12:57.160 Feeds. 00:12:57.160 --> 00:12:59.080 I saw that we're having a major 00:12:59.080 --> 00:13:01.160 impact on my reading habits. 00:13:01.160 --> 00:13:03.420 I started working with clients 00:13:03.420 --> 00:13:05.440 to launch blogs in my PR firm 00:13:05.440 --> 00:13:07.160 in early 2004. 00:13:07.160 --> 00:13:08.240 And then about a year ago, I 00:13:08.240 --> 00:13:10.160 woke up one Sunday morning and 00:13:10.160 --> 00:13:10.160 I said, 00:13:10.160 --> 00:13:12.160 "What's going on here? 00:13:12.160 --> 00:13:13.290 I'm working with clients and 00:13:13.290 --> 00:13:14.160 helping them blog. 00:13:14.160 --> 00:13:16.410 I'm reading you, I'm reading 00:13:16.410 --> 00:13:18.740 Scoville, and I'm learning so 00:13:18.740 --> 00:13:19.160 much. 00:13:19.160 --> 00:13:21.430 So I think I should have a blog 00:13:21.430 --> 00:13:22.160 also. 00:13:22.160 --> 00:13:23.160 Obviously. 00:13:23.160 --> 00:13:24.160 Yeah, obviously, right? 00:13:24.160 --> 00:13:25.160 Duh. 00:13:25.160 --> 00:13:26.160 You know? 00:13:26.160 --> 00:13:28.160 And you know... 00:13:28.160 --> 00:13:29.330 We're like religious evangel 00:13:29.330 --> 00:13:30.160 ists, aren't we? 00:13:30.160 --> 00:13:32.160 It's really shameless. 00:13:32.160 --> 00:13:34.160 And so I started to... 00:13:34.160 --> 00:13:35.840 So we get you to drink the Kool 00:13:35.840 --> 00:13:37.470 -Aid and then your job is to go 00:13:37.470 --> 00:13:38.160 out and get everybody else. 00:13:38.160 --> 00:13:39.160 It's like a cult, right? 00:13:39.160 --> 00:13:40.160 You know? 00:13:40.160 --> 00:13:41.160 Yeah. 00:13:41.160 --> 00:13:42.160 I'm sorry. 00:13:42.160 --> 00:13:43.160 We were... 00:13:43.160 --> 00:13:44.080 Of course, I'm going to say now 00:13:44.080 --> 00:13:45.600 , we were talking about this 00:13:45.600 --> 00:13:46.160 before, right? 00:13:46.160 --> 00:13:47.880 It's like I was listening to a 00:13:47.880 --> 00:13:49.740 podcast this morning with Ron 00:13:49.740 --> 00:13:51.160 Bloom and Adam Curry. 00:13:51.160 --> 00:13:52.610 And they were talking about the 00:13:52.610 --> 00:13:54.960 mechanics of building a really 00:13:54.960 --> 00:13:57.160 big audience for podcasts. 00:13:57.160 --> 00:13:58.490 And I was sort of shaking my 00:13:58.490 --> 00:14:00.160 head as I was listening to it. 00:14:00.160 --> 00:14:01.610 I was going, "No, no, that's 00:14:01.610 --> 00:14:02.160 not how it works." 00:14:02.160 --> 00:14:04.160 It's like a pyramid scheme. 00:14:04.160 --> 00:14:06.290 And you don't need to reach 10 00:14:06.290 --> 00:14:08.260 million people in one shot with 00:14:08.260 --> 00:14:09.160 your message. 00:14:09.160 --> 00:14:10.160 What you need? 00:14:10.160 --> 00:14:11.160 No, you... 00:14:11.160 --> 00:14:12.320 I mean, actually, you don't 00:14:12.320 --> 00:14:13.160 need to do anything. 00:14:13.160 --> 00:14:14.700 But if you want the thing to 00:14:14.700 --> 00:14:16.160 grow, it's just done, you know, 00:14:16.160 --> 00:14:18.160 one evangelist at a time. 00:14:18.160 --> 00:14:19.550 Basically, you know, my father 00:14:19.550 --> 00:14:20.510 was a really interesting 00:14:20.510 --> 00:14:21.160 experience. 00:14:21.160 --> 00:14:22.160 I mean, he... 00:14:22.160 --> 00:14:24.240 Before he did a podcast, he 00:14:24.240 --> 00:14:25.430 said, "Well, you know, I would 00:14:25.430 --> 00:14:26.340 never do a podcast about 00:14:26.340 --> 00:14:27.160 everything you'd say." 00:14:27.160 --> 00:14:28.360 Now that he's done one, he's 00:14:28.360 --> 00:14:29.240 got a billion ideas of things 00:14:29.240 --> 00:14:30.160 that he wants to talk about. 00:14:30.160 --> 00:14:32.160 He's telling everybody... 00:14:32.160 --> 00:14:33.160 Of course, I'm telling 00:14:33.160 --> 00:14:34.160 everybody about it. 00:14:34.160 --> 00:14:34.860 My brother's telling everybody 00:14:34.860 --> 00:14:35.160 about it. 00:14:35.160 --> 00:14:36.490 So all of a sudden, there's a 00:14:36.490 --> 00:14:37.830 whole other group of people 00:14:37.830 --> 00:14:39.430 that are getting infected with 00:14:39.430 --> 00:14:40.160 the disease, 00:14:40.160 --> 00:14:43.160 or maybe it's not a disease, 00:14:43.160 --> 00:14:43.160 but that's... 00:14:43.160 --> 00:14:45.410 It's all pipe, piper, pyramid 00:14:45.410 --> 00:14:47.590 scheme, evangelism, two-tier 00:14:47.590 --> 00:14:49.450 marketing, you know, the whole 00:14:49.450 --> 00:14:50.160 nine yards, right? 00:14:50.160 --> 00:14:51.160 It's like Amway, right? 00:14:51.160 --> 00:14:52.160 It's like Amway. 00:14:52.160 --> 00:14:53.470 Exactly, except there's no 00:14:53.470 --> 00:14:54.160 money in it. 00:14:54.160 --> 00:14:57.160 It's just for love, basically. 00:14:57.160 --> 00:14:59.160 I disagree with the money part. 00:14:59.160 --> 00:15:01.160 I'm getting some black glory. 00:15:01.160 --> 00:15:02.160 I disagree, too. 00:15:02.160 --> 00:15:03.160 There is money in it. 00:15:03.160 --> 00:15:04.160 Of course, there is. 00:15:04.160 --> 00:15:05.460 I mean, actually, there's a lot 00:15:05.460 --> 00:15:06.460 more money in it than you can 00:15:06.460 --> 00:15:07.160 get with advertising. 00:15:07.160 --> 00:15:08.160 Yeah. 00:15:08.160 --> 00:15:08.930 There's money from all 00:15:08.930 --> 00:15:10.030 different kinds of aspects, too 00:15:10.030 --> 00:15:11.490 , because if you look at it, I'm 00:15:11.490 --> 00:15:12.160 making money from it, too. 00:15:12.160 --> 00:15:13.160 Right. 00:15:13.160 --> 00:15:14.160 By winning clients. 00:15:14.160 --> 00:15:16.070 But for your clients, how much 00:15:16.070 --> 00:15:17.590 money do they spend to try to 00:15:17.590 --> 00:15:19.160 get the world to know who they 00:15:19.160 --> 00:15:19.160 are, right? 00:15:19.160 --> 00:15:20.160 That's why they hired you. 00:15:20.160 --> 00:15:21.160 That's right. 00:15:21.160 --> 00:15:22.160 And it's an extension. 00:15:22.160 --> 00:15:23.180 So if a blog can help you get 00:15:23.180 --> 00:15:24.410 better known, then aren't you 00:15:24.410 --> 00:15:25.160 making money? 00:15:25.160 --> 00:15:26.660 It's another tool we're going 00:15:26.660 --> 00:15:27.160 to use. 00:15:27.160 --> 00:15:29.150 I mean, we launched a practice 00:15:29.150 --> 00:15:31.160 under the name Microphone. 00:15:31.160 --> 00:15:32.520 It's raising a Kruppercat's 00:15:32.520 --> 00:15:33.160 microphone. 00:15:33.160 --> 00:15:35.160 That really helps companies. 00:15:35.160 --> 00:15:37.160 What does it mean? 00:15:37.160 --> 00:15:38.160 Micro persuasion? 00:15:38.160 --> 00:15:39.160 Yeah. 00:15:39.160 --> 00:15:40.990 When I launched the name, to me 00:15:40.990 --> 00:15:42.490 that meant that there are 00:15:42.490 --> 00:15:44.360 millions of small voices, micro 00:15:44.360 --> 00:15:47.210 voices, that have just as much 00:15:47.210 --> 00:15:50.160 influence as the mass voices. 00:15:50.160 --> 00:15:51.160 Yep. 00:15:51.160 --> 00:15:52.160 They are the mass, right? 00:15:52.160 --> 00:15:53.160 Which we pay for. 00:15:53.160 --> 00:15:53.970 I mean, you pay for mass persu 00:15:53.970 --> 00:15:54.160 asion. 00:15:54.160 --> 00:15:55.840 You pay for, you know, I mean, 00:15:55.840 --> 00:15:57.340 a hit on Good Morning America 00:15:57.340 --> 00:15:59.160 or you're a client or whatever. 00:15:59.160 --> 00:16:01.430 But the reality is that you 00:16:01.430 --> 00:16:03.700 have, you know, you get a hit 00:16:03.700 --> 00:16:06.160 on a Scobalizer or a Slash God. 00:16:06.160 --> 00:16:07.970 Your case, what you're doing is 00:16:07.970 --> 00:16:09.160 amazing, right? 00:16:09.160 --> 00:16:11.240 I mean, I go and I, personally, 00:16:11.240 --> 00:16:12.650 you're in every single 00:16:12.650 --> 00:16:14.160 PowerPoint that I show. 00:16:14.160 --> 00:16:16.510 Because on this topic, which is 00:16:16.510 --> 00:16:17.160 a lot. 00:16:17.160 --> 00:16:18.910 His blog is an interesting blog 00:16:18.910 --> 00:16:19.160 . 00:16:19.160 --> 00:16:20.380 Because you Google Netflix, you 00:16:20.380 --> 00:16:21.160 're the third one. 00:16:21.160 --> 00:16:22.510 You took ownership of Netflix, 00:16:22.510 --> 00:16:23.160 basically. 00:16:23.160 --> 00:16:24.160 Yeah. 00:16:24.160 --> 00:16:25.200 They didn't have a blog 00:16:25.200 --> 00:16:26.520 presence and you created one 00:16:26.520 --> 00:16:27.160 for them. 00:16:27.160 --> 00:16:28.870 You know how powerful this 00:16:28.870 --> 00:16:30.160 whole system is? 00:16:30.160 --> 00:16:31.450 On Tuesday, I posted Block 00:16:31.450 --> 00:16:33.150 buster's customer service number 00:16:33.150 --> 00:16:33.160 . 00:16:33.160 --> 00:16:35.160 And on Monday, I posted it. 00:16:35.160 --> 00:16:36.290 And by Wednesday, it was the 00:16:36.290 --> 00:16:37.570 number one hit for Blockbuster 00:16:37.570 --> 00:16:38.160 800. 00:16:38.160 --> 00:16:40.160 That's two days later. 00:16:40.160 --> 00:16:41.570 So I'm going after Blockbuster 00:16:41.570 --> 00:16:42.160 's today. 00:16:42.160 --> 00:16:44.160 So, it's bizarre. 00:16:44.160 --> 00:16:45.120 And this leads to a different 00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:46.160 topic, if I could ask this. 00:16:46.160 --> 00:16:47.160 Where do you want to go? 00:16:47.160 --> 00:16:50.140 Well, I wonder if Google One 00:16:50.140 --> 00:16:51.160 Day is going to wake up. 00:16:51.160 --> 00:16:52.970 And we're going to say, we're 00:16:52.970 --> 00:16:54.520 giving these blogs too much 00:16:54.520 --> 00:16:55.160 power. 00:16:55.160 --> 00:16:56.160 Turn it off. 00:16:56.160 --> 00:16:57.160 Yeah. 00:16:57.160 --> 00:16:59.160 We're going to make a change. 00:16:59.160 --> 00:17:00.160 I don't know. 00:17:00.160 --> 00:17:01.160 Well, go on with that. 00:17:01.160 --> 00:17:02.160 Well... 00:17:02.160 --> 00:17:03.160 What's your concern? 00:17:03.160 --> 00:17:04.160 Why is that a concern to you? 00:17:04.160 --> 00:17:05.160 Well, I hope they don't. 00:17:05.160 --> 00:17:06.160 Because... 00:17:06.160 --> 00:17:07.500 But I don't think it should be 00:17:07.500 --> 00:17:08.160 a concern. 00:17:08.160 --> 00:17:10.160 I mean, basically... 00:17:10.160 --> 00:17:11.160 Well, I'm sorry. 00:17:11.160 --> 00:17:12.160 Go ahead. 00:17:12.160 --> 00:17:13.160 I don't want to... 00:17:13.160 --> 00:17:14.220 Well, it's a concern because I 00:17:14.220 --> 00:17:16.300 think that that's, right now, 00:17:16.300 --> 00:17:19.160 one of the... 00:17:19.160 --> 00:17:22.020 One of the factors that's going 00:17:22.020 --> 00:17:23.780 to help push blocking your main 00:17:23.780 --> 00:17:24.160 stream. 00:17:24.160 --> 00:17:25.160 What is? 00:17:25.160 --> 00:17:26.160 The Google juice. 00:17:26.160 --> 00:17:27.630 I don't know if I don't agree 00:17:27.630 --> 00:17:29.160 with you because... 00:17:29.160 --> 00:17:30.160 Well, let me tell you why. 00:17:30.160 --> 00:17:31.160 If I may. 00:17:31.160 --> 00:17:32.160 Yeah, sure. 00:17:32.160 --> 00:17:33.160 The companies need comfort. 00:17:33.160 --> 00:17:34.160 Okay? 00:17:34.160 --> 00:17:35.160 The buying scene. 00:17:35.160 --> 00:17:38.150 So, are they going to buy into 00:17:38.150 --> 00:17:39.160 blogs? 00:17:39.160 --> 00:17:40.160 I don't know. 00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:41.750 But if you try it to search 00:17:41.750 --> 00:17:43.520 engine marketing, if you try it 00:17:43.520 --> 00:17:44.670 to optimization, that's 00:17:44.670 --> 00:17:45.160 something 00:17:45.160 --> 00:17:46.160 they're buying right now. 00:17:46.160 --> 00:17:47.510 Now, maybe in a year, that won 00:17:47.510 --> 00:17:48.160 't be true. 00:17:48.160 --> 00:17:49.160 They'll buy it no matter what. 00:17:49.160 --> 00:17:51.170 But, right now, they're saying, 00:17:51.170 --> 00:17:53.160 okay, so what's this getting? 00:17:53.160 --> 00:17:54.600 And when I show them the Google 00:17:54.600 --> 00:17:56.330 juice, that's like, immediately 00:17:56.330 --> 00:17:57.160 they get it? 00:17:57.160 --> 00:17:58.160 Yeah. 00:17:58.160 --> 00:17:59.160 And I say, okay, I understand. 00:17:59.160 --> 00:18:00.160 Yeah. 00:18:00.160 --> 00:18:02.350 So, Google makes that change 00:18:02.350 --> 00:18:04.450 that, I think, reduces the 00:18:04.450 --> 00:18:06.160 direct influence. 00:18:06.160 --> 00:18:07.160 Okay. 00:18:07.160 --> 00:18:08.160 Can I respond? 00:18:08.160 --> 00:18:09.160 Yeah. 00:18:09.160 --> 00:18:10.160 Okay. 00:18:10.160 --> 00:18:10.580 I don't care whether your 00:18:10.580 --> 00:18:11.160 companies have blogs or not. 00:18:11.160 --> 00:18:12.160 First of all. 00:18:12.160 --> 00:18:13.340 So, it means absolutely nothing 00:18:13.340 --> 00:18:14.180 to me one way or the other 00:18:14.180 --> 00:18:15.630 whether they do it or they don 00:18:15.630 --> 00:18:16.160 't. 00:18:16.160 --> 00:18:18.200 Second of all is that there's a 00:18:18.200 --> 00:18:20.260 real big danger in relying too 00:18:20.260 --> 00:18:22.160 heavily on sexualization. 00:18:22.160 --> 00:18:24.300 The whole point of blogging was 00:18:24.300 --> 00:18:26.580 to take, you know, to decentral 00:18:26.580 --> 00:18:28.160 ize to the extent that 00:18:28.160 --> 00:18:29.790 we're all sort of like looking 00:18:29.790 --> 00:18:31.160 to Google for approval. 00:18:31.160 --> 00:18:32.580 We're now going back to the old 00:18:32.580 --> 00:18:33.160 system. 00:18:33.160 --> 00:18:34.100 It's like, you know, okay, we 00:18:34.100 --> 00:18:35.160 traded in one boss for another. 00:18:35.160 --> 00:18:36.880 They used to be, you know, what 00:18:36.880 --> 00:18:38.110 anointed credibility was 00:18:38.110 --> 00:18:39.690 getting on the radio or getting 00:18:39.690 --> 00:18:40.160 quoted 00:18:40.160 --> 00:18:42.160 in the New York Times. 00:18:42.160 --> 00:18:44.160 Today, you know, fuck it. 00:18:44.160 --> 00:18:45.160 I don't care. 00:18:45.160 --> 00:18:46.300 I really honestly don't care 00:18:46.300 --> 00:18:47.480 whether I get quoted in the New 00:18:47.480 --> 00:18:48.160 York Times. 00:18:48.160 --> 00:18:49.160 I mean, maybe a little bit. 00:18:49.160 --> 00:18:50.160 My parents read it. 00:18:50.160 --> 00:18:51.340 So, it's like, it's good for 00:18:51.340 --> 00:18:53.180 family relations, but it doesn 00:18:53.180 --> 00:18:55.160 't build flow for me. 00:18:55.160 --> 00:18:56.660 They very rarely get the story 00:18:56.660 --> 00:18:57.160 right. 00:18:57.160 --> 00:18:58.440 You know, all the objective 00:18:58.440 --> 00:18:59.930 things, reasons why you might 00:18:59.930 --> 00:19:01.160 care about that seem to have 00:19:01.160 --> 00:19:02.840 faded now used to be that that 00:19:02.840 --> 00:19:04.160 was a very big deal. 00:19:04.160 --> 00:19:05.530 Now today that's been replaced 00:19:05.530 --> 00:19:06.160 by Google. 00:19:06.160 --> 00:19:07.160 But someday... 00:19:07.160 --> 00:19:07.940 I'm just quite like, by the way 00:19:07.940 --> 00:19:08.760 , like 300 PR firms out of 00:19:08.760 --> 00:19:09.160 business. 00:19:09.160 --> 00:19:10.160 I didn't do it. 00:19:10.160 --> 00:19:11.160 No, no, no. 00:19:11.160 --> 00:19:12.160 I didn't do it. 00:19:12.160 --> 00:19:13.160 No, no, not me. 00:19:13.160 --> 00:19:15.160 No, PR is in crisis of course. 00:19:15.160 --> 00:19:16.420 I mean, although PR has a 00:19:16.420 --> 00:19:17.950 chance to get back to its roots 00:19:17.950 --> 00:19:18.160 . 00:19:18.160 --> 00:19:20.330 The irony of the name PR was, 00:19:20.330 --> 00:19:22.160 what did it stand for? 00:19:22.160 --> 00:19:24.160 Public relations, right? 00:19:24.160 --> 00:19:25.490 But you didn't like, market to 00:19:25.490 --> 00:19:26.160 the public. 00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:28.160 You marketed it to the press. 00:19:28.160 --> 00:19:28.730 Why don't we say it really has 00:19:28.730 --> 00:19:29.160 real meaning? 00:19:29.160 --> 00:19:30.930 But that's not public, you know 00:19:30.930 --> 00:19:31.160 . 00:19:31.160 --> 00:19:32.480 They were sort of anything but 00:19:32.480 --> 00:19:33.160 the public. 00:19:33.160 --> 00:19:34.160 They were elitists. 00:19:34.160 --> 00:19:35.600 They were, you know, the king 00:19:35.600 --> 00:19:36.160 makers. 00:19:36.160 --> 00:19:37.360 They were, you know, gate 00:19:37.360 --> 00:19:38.670 keepers, all the rest of that 00:19:38.670 --> 00:19:39.160 stuff. 00:19:39.160 --> 00:19:40.710 Now, like you said, you get to 00:19:40.710 --> 00:19:42.160 do the job that you're always 00:19:42.160 --> 00:19:43.160 supposed to do. 00:19:43.160 --> 00:19:45.650 So, if your clients don't want 00:19:45.650 --> 00:19:47.890 to do it vlogging, if it doesn 00:19:47.890 --> 00:19:50.750 't get them Google juice, that's 00:19:50.750 --> 00:19:51.160 your problem. 00:19:51.160 --> 00:19:52.650 That's where it's locked in 00:19:52.650 --> 00:19:53.160 wide. 00:19:53.160 --> 00:19:54.160 I think you have to sell it. 00:19:54.160 --> 00:19:56.370 And one of the ways you sell it 00:19:56.370 --> 00:19:58.280 to them, we sell the whole Clut 00:19:58.280 --> 00:19:59.160 rain module. 00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:00.160 Do you? 00:20:00.160 --> 00:20:01.160 Oh, no. 00:20:01.160 --> 00:20:02.160 You have a Clutrain module? 00:20:02.160 --> 00:20:03.160 Mantra. 00:20:03.160 --> 00:20:04.160 Oh, Mantra. 00:20:04.160 --> 00:20:05.200 I thought you said, well, we 00:20:05.200 --> 00:20:06.160 can sell you the module. 00:20:06.160 --> 00:20:07.160 No, I had a Clutrain module. 00:20:07.160 --> 00:20:08.940 I've been making a lot of money 00:20:08.940 --> 00:20:09.160 . 00:20:09.160 --> 00:20:11.120 Here's the Clutrain, take a 00:20:11.120 --> 00:20:12.160 ride with me. 00:20:12.160 --> 00:20:13.160 Mantra is. 00:20:13.160 --> 00:20:14.160 That's great. 00:20:14.160 --> 00:20:15.160 We sell it. 00:20:15.160 --> 00:20:16.120 I mean, the human voice and the 00:20:16.120 --> 00:20:17.160 corporate speaker is dying. 00:20:17.160 --> 00:20:19.160 And I mean, I believe that. 00:20:19.160 --> 00:20:20.160 Do they buy it? 00:20:20.160 --> 00:20:21.160 That's the bad. 00:20:21.160 --> 00:20:22.160 No, no, they don't buy it. 00:20:22.160 --> 00:20:23.160 Number two is, do they get it? 00:20:23.160 --> 00:20:24.160 No, they don't get it. 00:20:24.160 --> 00:20:26.240 Are they going to try to use it 00:20:26.240 --> 00:20:27.660 and usurp it and pretend they 00:20:27.660 --> 00:20:28.160 're doing it? 00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:29.160 Maybe, right? 00:20:29.160 --> 00:20:30.160 No, I wouldn't. 00:20:30.160 --> 00:20:31.160 Otherwise, you wouldn't. 00:20:31.160 --> 00:20:32.430 At least personally, I wouldn't 00:20:32.430 --> 00:20:33.160 work with them. 00:20:33.160 --> 00:20:34.160 You wouldn't do that, right? 00:20:34.160 --> 00:20:35.160 Good for you. 00:20:35.160 --> 00:20:36.910 That means that you have a soul 00:20:36.910 --> 00:20:37.160 . 00:20:37.160 --> 00:20:38.160 Congratulations. 00:20:38.160 --> 00:20:39.470 Well, I've been freaking the K 00:20:39.470 --> 00:20:40.160 ool-Aid one. 00:20:40.160 --> 00:20:40.980 That's the other way of looking 00:20:40.980 --> 00:20:41.160 at it. 00:20:41.160 --> 00:20:42.160 Yeah. 00:20:42.160 --> 00:20:43.160 I think of it as a soul. 00:20:43.160 --> 00:20:44.160 You think of it as Kool-Aid. 00:20:44.160 --> 00:20:45.160 Okay, great. 00:20:45.160 --> 00:20:46.160 You're a distributor. 00:20:46.160 --> 00:20:47.160 Right. 00:20:47.160 --> 00:20:48.160 Me too. 00:20:48.160 --> 00:20:49.160 I'm weighing all the way. 00:20:49.160 --> 00:20:50.160 That's right. 00:20:50.160 --> 00:20:51.160 That's cool. 00:20:51.160 --> 00:20:52.160 So, do you enjoy your work? 00:20:52.160 --> 00:20:53.160 I love what I do. 00:20:53.160 --> 00:20:54.160 You love what I do? 00:20:54.160 --> 00:20:54.680 I love what I do more so now 00:20:54.680 --> 00:20:55.160 than I ever have. 00:20:55.160 --> 00:20:56.160 I've been in PR for 15 years. 00:20:56.160 --> 00:20:57.160 I always loved it. 00:20:57.160 --> 00:20:58.160 I guess I'm a rare bird. 00:20:58.160 --> 00:20:58.780 I think I was a PR person in a 00:20:58.780 --> 00:20:59.160 former life. 00:20:59.160 --> 00:20:59.840 Yeah, I think in some ways you 00:20:59.840 --> 00:21:00.160 went down. 00:21:00.160 --> 00:21:01.160 I've been in PR for 15 years. 00:21:01.160 --> 00:21:02.160 I always loved it. 00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:03.160 I guess I'm a rare bird. 00:21:03.160 --> 00:21:04.160 But. 00:21:04.160 --> 00:21:06.650 I think I was a PR person in a 00:21:06.650 --> 00:21:08.160 former life. 00:21:08.160 --> 00:21:09.160 Yeah. 00:21:09.160 --> 00:21:10.760 I think in some ways you went 00:21:10.760 --> 00:21:11.160 down. 00:21:11.160 --> 00:21:12.160 Absolutely. 00:21:12.160 --> 00:21:13.160 Except nobody pays me. 00:21:13.160 --> 00:21:14.160 That's right. 00:21:14.160 --> 00:21:15.160 Damn it. 00:21:15.160 --> 00:21:16.580 Somehow we got to figure out 00:21:16.580 --> 00:21:17.160 that one. 00:21:17.160 --> 00:21:18.540 Would you travel across the 00:21:18.540 --> 00:21:20.160 country and do a great thing? 00:21:20.160 --> 00:21:21.160 I wish. 00:21:21.160 --> 00:21:22.360 I mean, doesn't everybody live 00:21:22.360 --> 00:21:23.160 to be Dave Warner? 00:21:23.160 --> 00:21:24.160 I mean, it's just like. 00:21:24.160 --> 00:21:25.160 Is that right? 00:21:25.160 --> 00:21:26.160 Really? 00:21:26.160 --> 00:21:27.160 It's not so great. 00:21:27.160 --> 00:21:28.300 I think you embody like every 00:21:28.300 --> 00:21:29.930 male in the 30s and 40s and 50s 00:21:29.930 --> 00:21:30.160 . 00:21:30.160 --> 00:21:31.410 Well, I waited a long time for 00:21:31.410 --> 00:21:32.160 you to do this. 00:21:32.160 --> 00:21:33.780 I, you know, sort of like put 00:21:33.780 --> 00:21:35.290 down roots and, you know, got 00:21:35.290 --> 00:21:37.160 bored out of my mind. 00:21:37.160 --> 00:21:38.160 In Silicon Valley. 00:21:38.160 --> 00:21:39.160 Yeah. 00:21:39.160 --> 00:21:41.000 It was either do it now or 00:21:41.000 --> 00:21:42.160 never do it. 00:21:42.160 --> 00:21:43.160 Yeah. 00:21:43.160 --> 00:21:45.160 Well, I'm having a good time. 00:21:45.160 --> 00:21:46.160 I'm having a good time. 00:21:46.160 --> 00:21:48.320 You know, all my ideas now have 00:21:48.320 --> 00:21:49.160 taken root. 00:21:49.160 --> 00:21:51.290 And, you know, and so they're 00:21:51.290 --> 00:21:53.420 not considered, you know, all 00:21:53.420 --> 00:21:55.160 that far out anymore. 00:21:55.160 --> 00:21:56.160 So what's next? 00:21:56.160 --> 00:21:57.160 Me? 00:21:57.160 --> 00:21:59.160 Yeah, that's what I like. 00:21:59.160 --> 00:22:01.070 Well, right now, I haven't 00:22:01.070 --> 00:22:02.420 really been all that secretive 00:22:02.420 --> 00:22:03.160 about it. 00:22:03.160 --> 00:22:05.060 I mean, basically, I think in 00:22:05.060 --> 00:22:07.160 terms of formats and protocols, 00:22:07.160 --> 00:22:08.160 it's OPML. 00:22:08.160 --> 00:22:10.210 OPML comes as the next layer up 00:22:10.210 --> 00:22:11.160 after RSS. 00:22:11.160 --> 00:22:13.160 I mean, you know, that's the 00:22:13.160 --> 00:22:15.160 role OPML plays right now is, 00:22:15.160 --> 00:22:18.160 you know, sort of, it's where, 00:22:18.160 --> 00:22:19.720 you know, it's doing lists of 00:22:19.720 --> 00:22:21.160 subscriptions, right? 00:22:21.160 --> 00:22:22.360 And so it can be used for book 00:22:22.360 --> 00:22:23.400 mark, it can be used for 00:22:23.400 --> 00:22:25.160 directories, it can be used for 00:22:25.160 --> 00:22:27.090 presentations, it can be used 00:22:27.090 --> 00:22:29.050 for thinking, for organizing 00:22:29.050 --> 00:22:30.160 and planning. 00:22:30.160 --> 00:22:32.350 And it can actually is pretty 00:22:32.350 --> 00:22:34.160 good for group wear. 00:22:34.160 --> 00:22:35.830 And it sort of goes in a lot of 00:22:35.830 --> 00:22:37.770 different, and then if you take 00:22:37.770 --> 00:22:40.160 that and like mix it in 00:22:40.160 --> 00:22:41.620 with the internet and all the, 00:22:41.620 --> 00:22:43.070 you know, basic sort of simple 00:22:43.070 --> 00:22:45.160 networking like HTML has, you 00:22:45.160 --> 00:22:46.450 know, where you can link from 00:22:46.450 --> 00:22:47.730 one place to another, it gets 00:22:47.730 --> 00:22:49.160 pretty powerful, you know. 00:22:49.160 --> 00:22:50.910 So I've been wanting to do this 00:22:50.910 --> 00:22:51.160 . 00:22:51.160 --> 00:22:52.710 I mean, I got started on doing 00:22:52.710 --> 00:22:54.160 it in early 2002. 00:22:54.160 --> 00:22:55.500 And then I, you know, I got 00:22:55.500 --> 00:22:57.160 sick and then I couldn't do it. 00:22:57.160 --> 00:22:58.640 But everything down and sort of 00:22:58.640 --> 00:23:00.280 , you know, reset everything and 00:23:00.280 --> 00:23:01.160 figure out what I was 00:23:01.160 --> 00:23:03.160 really doing and quit smoking. 00:23:03.160 --> 00:23:04.160 Now I'm losing weight. 00:23:04.160 --> 00:23:05.160 That's the big thing, right? 00:23:05.160 --> 00:23:06.690 I'm losing weight and getting 00:23:06.690 --> 00:23:07.160 sick. 00:23:07.160 --> 00:23:08.370 That's why Florida has been 00:23:08.370 --> 00:23:09.260 really good for me and 00:23:09.260 --> 00:23:10.160 continues to be. 00:23:10.160 --> 00:23:13.160 So you're retiring to Florida? 00:23:13.160 --> 00:23:14.650 I don't think there's any 00:23:14.650 --> 00:23:16.160 retirement about it. 00:23:16.160 --> 00:23:18.010 No, I'm not retiring, but 00:23:18.010 --> 00:23:20.160 Florida is kind of, you know, 00:23:20.160 --> 00:23:21.160 it's one of these places where 00:23:21.160 --> 00:23:22.820 I've like always wanted to like 00:23:22.820 --> 00:23:24.160 be there for some extended 00:23:24.160 --> 00:23:25.160 period of time. 00:23:25.160 --> 00:23:26.540 I wanted to live at the beach 00:23:26.540 --> 00:23:28.160 and, you know, that's another 00:23:28.160 --> 00:23:29.160 one of those things. 00:23:29.160 --> 00:23:30.720 Like, you know, okay, like when 00:23:30.720 --> 00:23:32.160 were you planning on doing it? 00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:33.780 You know, it's either like do 00:23:33.780 --> 00:23:35.320 it now or maybe you don't ever 00:23:35.320 --> 00:23:36.160 get to do it. 00:23:36.160 --> 00:23:38.180 So, yeah, I'm trying to create 00:23:38.180 --> 00:23:40.160 a lifestyle at the same time. 00:23:40.160 --> 00:23:41.900 There's a lot, you know, if I 00:23:41.900 --> 00:23:43.420 want to do a business and like 00:23:43.420 --> 00:23:44.160 you said, basically the 00:23:44.160 --> 00:23:45.760 ideas are becoming acceptable 00:23:45.760 --> 00:23:46.160 now. 00:23:46.160 --> 00:23:47.340 And if I wanted to really build 00:23:47.340 --> 00:23:48.550 a development team today, I 00:23:48.550 --> 00:23:49.160 could do it. 00:23:49.160 --> 00:23:51.580 I raised money to do it and, 00:23:51.580 --> 00:23:53.900 you know, I don't know if I 00:23:53.900 --> 00:23:56.160 could do that in Florida. 00:23:56.160 --> 00:23:57.710 I might try to make this 00:23:57.710 --> 00:23:59.430 interview with you as much as I 00:23:59.430 --> 00:24:00.160 can with us. 00:24:00.160 --> 00:24:02.220 The trip is that it's not 00:24:02.220 --> 00:24:04.160 really an interview. 00:24:04.160 --> 00:24:06.160 It's more of a conversation. 00:24:06.160 --> 00:24:07.060 Yeah, I mean, it's like let's 00:24:07.060 --> 00:24:07.850 talk about the clue train, 00:24:07.850 --> 00:24:08.160 right? 00:24:08.160 --> 00:24:09.720 The clue train says that there 00:24:09.720 --> 00:24:11.160 's like no top or bottom. 00:24:11.160 --> 00:24:13.020 It's not like, you know, like, 00:24:13.020 --> 00:24:15.160 you know, two-tier or whatever. 00:24:15.160 --> 00:24:16.160 We're just hanging out here. 00:24:16.160 --> 00:24:17.810 Well, something I want to ask 00:24:17.810 --> 00:24:19.910 you actually, I could, is, and 00:24:19.910 --> 00:24:21.160 I know I'm, I know I'm totally 00:24:21.160 --> 00:24:22.760 just, but the question's on the 00:24:22.760 --> 00:24:23.160 line. 00:24:23.160 --> 00:24:24.160 Go ahead. 00:24:24.160 --> 00:24:25.160 Like RSS. 00:24:25.160 --> 00:24:26.160 Yeah. 00:24:26.160 --> 00:24:28.160 I mean, we all believe it. 00:24:28.160 --> 00:24:29.160 We all use it. 00:24:29.160 --> 00:24:30.160 We all, right? 00:24:30.160 --> 00:24:31.160 Okay. 00:24:31.160 --> 00:24:32.890 And when we live in the aggreg 00:24:32.890 --> 00:24:34.830 ators, we take, we walk out on 00:24:34.830 --> 00:24:37.160 that street ten feet. 00:24:37.160 --> 00:24:38.160 Yeah. 00:24:38.160 --> 00:24:39.640 Pull up ten people and read 00:24:39.640 --> 00:24:40.160 them. 00:24:40.160 --> 00:24:41.160 And not one. 00:24:41.160 --> 00:24:42.160 I don't know. 00:24:42.160 --> 00:24:43.160 No present. 00:24:43.160 --> 00:24:44.000 We'll probably know what RSS is 00:24:44.000 --> 00:24:44.160 . 00:24:44.160 --> 00:24:45.160 Maybe they've heard it. 00:24:45.160 --> 00:24:46.160 Okay. 00:24:46.160 --> 00:24:47.420 Can you get in trouble for 00:24:47.420 --> 00:24:48.160 doing that? 00:24:48.160 --> 00:24:50.160 Yeah, I can do that. 00:24:50.160 --> 00:24:51.160 So what's the point? 00:24:51.160 --> 00:24:51.960 Well, the point I'm making is 00:24:51.960 --> 00:24:53.820 that, or question, is that how 00:24:53.820 --> 00:24:55.940 do we, I mean, I think that we 00:24:55.940 --> 00:24:56.160 're 00:24:56.160 --> 00:24:57.160 all evangelists here for RSS. 00:24:57.160 --> 00:24:58.160 But why? 00:24:58.160 --> 00:24:59.400 Why do you have to be something 00:24:59.400 --> 00:25:00.160 for everybody? 00:25:00.160 --> 00:25:02.340 This is what, I get asked that, 00:25:02.340 --> 00:25:04.420 this gets, you know, comes up 00:25:04.420 --> 00:25:06.160 all the time, right? 00:25:06.160 --> 00:25:08.430 And five years ago or three 00:25:08.430 --> 00:25:10.550 years ago, four guys could be 00:25:10.550 --> 00:25:12.200 sitting at a table in a 00:25:12.200 --> 00:25:13.160 Starbucks 00:25:13.160 --> 00:25:14.820 on 42nd Street and none of them 00:25:14.820 --> 00:25:16.160 would have heard of RSS. 00:25:16.160 --> 00:25:17.140 Today, all of them have and 00:25:17.140 --> 00:25:18.160 they all use it, right? 00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:19.470 So that's an awful lot of 00:25:19.470 --> 00:25:21.160 growth right there, okay? 00:25:21.160 --> 00:25:22.160 It's fast. 00:25:22.160 --> 00:25:23.160 Yeah. 00:25:23.160 --> 00:25:24.750 And maybe five years from now, 00:25:24.750 --> 00:25:26.360 you'll go out on 42nd Street 00:25:26.360 --> 00:25:27.800 and they'll all be talking 00:25:27.800 --> 00:25:29.650 about RSS and how, you know, 00:25:29.650 --> 00:25:31.440 their company is adopting it 00:25:31.440 --> 00:25:33.540 across the board and how, you 00:25:33.540 --> 00:25:35.350 know, they're going to the next 00:25:35.350 --> 00:25:35.920 thing. 00:25:35.920 --> 00:25:37.150 Some guys are talking about 00:25:37.150 --> 00:25:38.370 this thing called OPML and they 00:25:38.370 --> 00:25:39.370 're not sure what it is or 00:25:39.370 --> 00:25:39.960 whatever. 00:25:39.960 --> 00:25:41.570 And I feel like it's like when 00:25:41.570 --> 00:25:42.960 I talk about the web. 00:25:42.960 --> 00:25:44.040 But that's the way it should 00:25:44.040 --> 00:25:44.960 always be, Steve. 00:25:44.960 --> 00:25:45.920 There should always be 00:25:45.920 --> 00:25:47.210 something new happening that, 00:25:47.210 --> 00:25:48.390 you know, that is making its 00:25:48.390 --> 00:25:48.960 way through, 00:25:48.960 --> 00:25:50.960 you know, our civilization. 00:25:50.960 --> 00:25:51.960 It should always be. 00:25:51.960 --> 00:25:53.600 If it ever stops being that way 00:25:53.600 --> 00:25:55.540 , then you should be, like, 00:25:55.540 --> 00:25:55.960 worried. 00:25:55.960 --> 00:25:57.490 Not worried that people don't 00:25:57.490 --> 00:25:57.960 know. 00:25:57.960 --> 00:25:59.850 I'm worried that people think 00:25:59.850 --> 00:26:00.960 it's too hard. 00:26:00.960 --> 00:26:02.960 It is too hard. 00:26:02.960 --> 00:26:03.960 Right. 00:26:03.960 --> 00:26:05.640 Maybe that's the answer to that 00:26:05.640 --> 00:26:05.960 one. 00:26:05.960 --> 00:26:07.350 And how does it get easier is a 00:26:07.350 --> 00:26:08.960 really interesting question. 00:26:08.960 --> 00:26:10.290 It's not a technological 00:26:10.290 --> 00:26:10.960 question. 00:26:10.960 --> 00:26:12.960 It's a human question. 00:26:12.960 --> 00:26:14.960 It's a political question. 00:26:14.960 --> 00:26:16.480 It's people putting their pride 00:26:16.480 --> 00:26:17.730 aside and deciding to work 00:26:17.730 --> 00:26:18.960 together a question. 00:26:18.960 --> 00:26:20.180 And, you know, there's very 00:26:20.180 --> 00:26:20.960 little of that. 00:26:20.960 --> 00:26:22.550 Once RSS became, you know, 00:26:22.550 --> 00:26:24.480 somewhat successful, all of a 00:26:24.480 --> 00:26:25.960 sudden a lot of people wanted 00:26:25.960 --> 00:26:25.960 to 00:26:25.960 --> 00:26:27.960 take it over and own it. 00:26:27.960 --> 00:26:29.990 And then they, you know, so 00:26:29.990 --> 00:26:32.080 they could split it in two, but 00:26:32.080 --> 00:26:32.960 they could never make the whole 00:26:32.960 --> 00:26:34.480 thing go the way they wanted it 00:26:34.480 --> 00:26:34.960 to go. 00:26:34.960 --> 00:26:36.860 The only way for that to happen 00:26:36.860 --> 00:26:38.530 is for people to drop their 00:26:38.530 --> 00:26:39.960 pride and say, okay, I'm going 00:26:39.960 --> 00:26:41.570 to do it the way you want to do 00:26:41.570 --> 00:26:41.960 it. 00:26:41.960 --> 00:26:43.140 There has to be an awful lot of 00:26:43.140 --> 00:26:43.960 that happening. 00:26:43.960 --> 00:26:44.960 And it's not happening. 00:26:44.960 --> 00:26:46.410 And look what happened with 00:26:46.410 --> 00:26:46.960 Yahoo. 00:26:46.960 --> 00:26:48.500 They have this ugly, you know, 00:26:48.500 --> 00:26:49.940 little graphic that they ask 00:26:49.940 --> 00:26:51.960 every blogger to put on their 00:26:51.960 --> 00:26:52.960 site. 00:26:52.960 --> 00:26:53.960 Right. 00:26:53.960 --> 00:26:54.960 Well, I won't do it. 00:26:54.960 --> 00:26:55.960 You know, I refuse to do it 00:26:55.960 --> 00:26:56.910 because I think it's just a 00:26:56.910 --> 00:26:57.960 tiny little bit of working 00:26:57.960 --> 00:26:58.960 together 00:26:58.960 --> 00:26:59.960 there. 00:26:59.960 --> 00:27:00.990 We can solve that problem and 00:27:00.990 --> 00:27:02.130 make it easy for, you know, for 00:27:02.130 --> 00:27:03.960 anybody to be in that space. 00:27:03.960 --> 00:27:05.180 Of course, their attitude is we 00:27:05.180 --> 00:27:06.200 're the only aggregator out 00:27:06.200 --> 00:27:06.960 there, right? 00:27:06.960 --> 00:27:07.960 No. 00:27:07.960 --> 00:27:09.000 Well, they've made it easier 00:27:09.000 --> 00:27:09.960 for my mom to read blogs. 00:27:09.960 --> 00:27:10.960 She doesn't know their blogs. 00:27:10.960 --> 00:27:12.150 And I just set up a couple of 00:27:12.150 --> 00:27:12.960 beats for her. 00:27:12.960 --> 00:27:13.960 Yeah. 00:27:13.960 --> 00:27:14.960 And now she goes through. 00:27:14.960 --> 00:27:15.960 Right. 00:27:15.960 --> 00:27:17.490 But why does it have to be 00:27:17.490 --> 00:27:18.960 specific to Yahoo? 00:27:18.960 --> 00:27:19.960 You can use that. 00:27:19.960 --> 00:27:21.380 Well, they're the ones that, I 00:27:21.380 --> 00:27:22.480 think they have one of the 00:27:22.480 --> 00:27:23.960 better interfaces for reading 00:27:23.960 --> 00:27:23.960 for 00:27:23.960 --> 00:27:24.960 someone who's not technical. 00:27:24.960 --> 00:27:25.750 What if somebody has a better 00:27:25.750 --> 00:27:26.480 one for people who are non- 00:27:26.480 --> 00:27:26.960 technical? 00:27:26.960 --> 00:27:27.960 Let's write one. 00:27:27.960 --> 00:27:29.960 Why don't we create one? 00:27:29.960 --> 00:27:30.960 There's a need. 00:27:30.960 --> 00:27:32.850 But then, you know, do you see 00:27:32.850 --> 00:27:34.670 my point is that just the tini 00:27:34.670 --> 00:27:36.280 est little bit of working 00:27:36.280 --> 00:27:36.960 together, 00:27:36.960 --> 00:27:37.960 we couldn't get it. 00:27:37.960 --> 00:27:39.170 You know, I tried approaching 00:27:39.170 --> 00:27:39.960 them privately. 00:27:39.960 --> 00:27:40.960 They wouldn't respond. 00:27:40.960 --> 00:27:42.790 I tried asking them that I saw 00:27:42.790 --> 00:27:44.700 a guy from Yahoo talking about 00:27:44.700 --> 00:27:46.070 their aggregator at a 00:27:46.070 --> 00:27:46.960 conference. 00:27:46.960 --> 00:27:47.960 I raised my hand. 00:27:47.960 --> 00:27:49.110 I said, hey, how about working 00:27:49.110 --> 00:27:49.960 with everybody else? 00:27:49.960 --> 00:27:50.960 They sort of snickered. 00:27:50.960 --> 00:27:52.490 Like, well, why should we do 00:27:52.490 --> 00:27:52.960 that? 00:27:52.960 --> 00:27:53.960 And then I called them out. 00:27:53.960 --> 00:27:55.730 I called the Yahoo problem on 00:27:55.730 --> 00:27:56.960 scripting news. 00:27:56.960 --> 00:27:58.960 Escalated up the next level. 00:27:58.960 --> 00:28:00.960 Total silence, you know. 00:28:00.960 --> 00:28:02.960 I mean, you know, that's bad. 00:28:02.960 --> 00:28:05.100 I mean, you know, I think what 00:28:05.100 --> 00:28:07.140 they think is that I'm jealous 00:28:07.140 --> 00:28:08.960 in some way or, you know, 00:28:08.960 --> 00:28:10.960 I'm pissed off or whatever. 00:28:10.960 --> 00:28:12.040 Yeah, I'm pissed off, but that 00:28:12.040 --> 00:28:12.960 's not insurmountable. 00:28:12.960 --> 00:28:15.990 I can easily get a swage, you 00:28:15.990 --> 00:28:16.960 know. 00:28:16.960 --> 00:28:18.370 I found out from Scobley 00:28:18.370 --> 00:28:20.080 yesterday that these guys at 00:28:20.080 --> 00:28:21.960 Microsoft are scared of me. 00:28:21.960 --> 00:28:23.370 And I said to them, I said, 00:28:23.370 --> 00:28:24.960 well, that's pretty good. 00:28:24.960 --> 00:28:26.440 It's kind of like, how could 00:28:26.440 --> 00:28:27.860 Nixon have ever opened up 00:28:27.860 --> 00:28:29.450 relations with China if they 00:28:29.450 --> 00:28:29.960 weren't scared of him? 00:28:29.960 --> 00:28:31.690 That's quite a comparison, Nick 00:28:31.690 --> 00:28:31.960 y. 00:28:31.960 --> 00:28:32.960 What? 00:28:32.960 --> 00:28:34.960 Oh, yeah. 00:28:34.960 --> 00:28:35.960 Oops. 00:28:35.960 --> 00:28:39.900 Gee, where should we go with 00:28:39.900 --> 00:28:40.960 that? 00:28:40.960 --> 00:28:42.260 Just so you know, Dave's 00:28:42.260 --> 00:28:43.780 holding up his fingers on the 00:28:43.780 --> 00:28:44.960 inside of his head. 00:28:44.960 --> 00:28:46.960 Like, bring my shoulders up. 00:28:46.960 --> 00:28:47.960 We need video casting. 00:28:47.960 --> 00:28:48.960 Yeah, let's go. 00:28:48.960 --> 00:28:49.960 Oh, it's a good thing Mark Pil 00:28:49.960 --> 00:28:50.950 grim isn't vlogging anymore 00:28:50.950 --> 00:28:52.290 because he'd have a field day 00:28:52.290 --> 00:28:52.960 with that. 00:28:52.960 --> 00:28:54.960 Oh, yeah. 00:28:54.960 --> 00:28:55.960 Sorry. 00:28:55.960 --> 00:28:57.450 Oops, that was the wrong thing 00:28:57.450 --> 00:28:57.960 to say. 00:28:57.960 --> 00:28:58.960 Anyway. 00:28:58.960 --> 00:28:59.960 I might come back. 00:28:59.960 --> 00:29:02.220 Yeah, so working together would 00:29:02.220 --> 00:29:02.960 be good. 00:29:02.960 --> 00:29:03.960 I don't know. 00:29:03.960 --> 00:29:05.310 I think that it's also, we've 00:29:05.310 --> 00:29:07.060 got this problem with content 00:29:07.060 --> 00:29:09.020 modification and what Google's 00:29:09.020 --> 00:29:09.960 doing with AutoLink. 00:29:09.960 --> 00:29:10.960 And I think that's terrible. 00:29:10.960 --> 00:29:12.800 And, you know, it's a radical 00:29:12.800 --> 00:29:14.960 ization and commercialization. 00:29:14.960 --> 00:29:16.160 A totally unnecessary 00:29:16.160 --> 00:29:17.960 commercialization of the web. 00:29:17.960 --> 00:29:18.810 And you know what's coming next 00:29:18.810 --> 00:29:18.960 . 00:29:18.960 --> 00:29:20.060 They've got a browser 00:29:20.060 --> 00:29:20.960 involvement. 00:29:20.960 --> 00:29:22.810 Just buy another Mozilla 00:29:22.810 --> 00:29:24.940 program or just a job to Google 00:29:24.940 --> 00:29:25.960 this week. 00:29:25.960 --> 00:29:26.960 Yeah. 00:29:26.960 --> 00:29:27.960 And the venture, that's right. 00:29:27.960 --> 00:29:29.510 And a venture capitalist in 00:29:29.510 --> 00:29:30.830 Silicon Valley funded the 00:29:30.830 --> 00:29:32.240 original guy who worked on 00:29:32.240 --> 00:29:32.960 Firefox. 00:29:32.960 --> 00:29:34.210 You know what these guys are 00:29:34.210 --> 00:29:34.960 doing there? 00:29:34.960 --> 00:29:36.340 They're getting ready to put 00:29:36.340 --> 00:29:37.960 ads, our ads, if you have ads, 00:29:37.960 --> 00:29:39.460 are going to move out of your 00:29:39.460 --> 00:29:40.960 page and into their Chrome. 00:29:40.960 --> 00:29:41.730 And you're going to get bootk 00:29:41.730 --> 00:29:41.960 its. 00:29:41.960 --> 00:29:43.300 And they're going to make all 00:29:43.300 --> 00:29:43.960 the money. 00:29:43.960 --> 00:29:45.100 And then the next thing is they 00:29:45.100 --> 00:29:46.110 're going to sell out to the 00:29:46.110 --> 00:29:46.960 Christian right. 00:29:46.960 --> 00:29:48.670 And then all of a sudden we're 00:29:48.670 --> 00:29:50.050 all going to become Bush 00:29:50.050 --> 00:29:50.960 supporters. 00:29:50.960 --> 00:29:53.960 Jim Bush in 2008, all the way. 00:29:53.960 --> 00:29:57.960 That'll be fun. 00:29:57.960 --> 00:29:59.550 Jason Calcanus is good about 00:29:59.550 --> 00:30:01.290 calling out people that do that 00:30:01.290 --> 00:30:01.960 though. 00:30:01.960 --> 00:30:03.580 I mean, he's got 70 web logs 00:30:03.580 --> 00:30:03.960 now. 00:30:03.960 --> 00:30:05.220 And he's really, anytime 00:30:05.220 --> 00:30:06.610 somebody comes up with these 00:30:06.610 --> 00:30:08.260 brilliant business plans to, 00:30:08.260 --> 00:30:10.090 you know, take the content that 00:30:10.090 --> 00:30:10.960 we all write. 00:30:10.960 --> 00:30:12.110 I mean, you know, we spend a 00:30:12.110 --> 00:30:13.280 lot of energy on this and they 00:30:13.280 --> 00:30:14.650 slap an ad on it and expect to 00:30:14.650 --> 00:30:15.960 make it get rich on it. 00:30:15.960 --> 00:30:17.180 Really, I wasn't aware that he 00:30:17.180 --> 00:30:17.960 was doing that. 00:30:17.960 --> 00:30:19.100 Yeah, he's called, you should 00:30:19.100 --> 00:30:19.960 check out his blog. 00:30:19.960 --> 00:30:21.960 He really calls out these guys. 00:30:21.960 --> 00:30:23.960 The Nano Publishing Blog? 00:30:23.960 --> 00:30:25.960 That's what I mean. 00:30:25.960 --> 00:30:27.960 I subscribe to it. 00:30:27.960 --> 00:30:29.960 It's Jason Calcanus. 00:30:29.960 --> 00:30:31.610 Oh, yeah, I don't subscribe to 00:30:31.610 --> 00:30:31.960 it. 00:30:31.960 --> 00:30:33.350 It's really good. He calls 00:30:33.350 --> 00:30:33.960 these guys out. 00:30:33.960 --> 00:30:35.470 He's sat at South by Southwest, 00:30:35.470 --> 00:30:36.350 I think, at one of the 00:30:36.350 --> 00:30:36.960 conferences. 00:30:36.960 --> 00:30:38.960 They know what was it. 00:30:38.960 --> 00:30:40.960 I remember that conference. 00:30:40.960 --> 00:30:41.860 Of course his bread and butter 00:30:41.860 --> 00:30:42.960 depends on them not doing that. 00:30:42.960 --> 00:30:44.960 Well, ours too to some degree. 00:30:44.960 --> 00:30:46.390 I don't think they should slap 00:30:46.390 --> 00:30:46.960 ads on it. 00:30:46.960 --> 00:30:48.960 Micropersuasion, Orbitcast. 00:30:48.960 --> 00:30:50.120 No, without there being some 00:30:50.120 --> 00:30:50.960 sort of rush here. 00:30:50.960 --> 00:30:52.230 What's the worst example of 00:30:52.230 --> 00:30:52.960 that happening? 00:30:52.960 --> 00:30:54.960 Who's doing the worst? 00:30:54.960 --> 00:30:56.210 Well, there's concern that blog 00:30:56.210 --> 00:30:56.960 lines will do it. 00:30:56.960 --> 00:30:58.310 I mean, we're all syndicated in 00:30:58.310 --> 00:30:58.960 blog lines. 00:30:58.960 --> 00:31:00.730 I mean, Dave, you've got about 00:31:00.730 --> 00:31:02.960 3,000 subscribers there. 00:31:02.960 --> 00:31:04.960 I'm worried for ads on there 00:31:04.960 --> 00:31:06.230 without sharing the revenue 00:31:06.230 --> 00:31:06.960 back with us. 00:31:06.960 --> 00:31:08.090 That's why, like, Google is at 00:31:08.090 --> 00:31:09.060 least they give us some pitt 00:31:09.060 --> 00:31:09.960 ance of the revenue. 00:31:09.960 --> 00:31:11.260 See, I'm not that concerned 00:31:11.260 --> 00:31:11.960 about that. 00:31:11.960 --> 00:31:13.680 What if they're making money 00:31:13.680 --> 00:31:14.960 off your content? 00:31:14.960 --> 00:31:16.480 You could also not change the 00:31:16.480 --> 00:31:16.960 feed. 00:31:16.960 --> 00:31:18.230 I'd like to be able to change 00:31:18.230 --> 00:31:18.960 my feed and say... 00:31:18.960 --> 00:31:20.690 I'm more concerned when they 00:31:20.690 --> 00:31:21.960 change what I say. 00:31:21.960 --> 00:31:23.960 You know, when they make me out 00:31:23.960 --> 00:31:25.850 to, you know, when they point 00:31:25.850 --> 00:31:26.960 to Amazon for my content, 00:31:26.960 --> 00:31:28.640 and I don't point to Amazon as 00:31:28.640 --> 00:31:30.960 a matter of principle because 00:31:30.960 --> 00:31:31.960 they're patent abusers, 00:31:31.960 --> 00:31:33.830 and when they change my content 00:31:33.830 --> 00:31:34.960 to point to Amazon, 00:31:34.960 --> 00:31:36.960 then I feel you really used. 00:31:36.960 --> 00:31:39.240 I mean, feel betrayed, and 00:31:39.240 --> 00:31:40.960 specifically when it happens 00:31:40.960 --> 00:31:40.960 for Google 00:31:40.960 --> 00:31:42.530 because of what we were saying 00:31:42.530 --> 00:31:42.960 before is, like, 00:31:42.960 --> 00:31:43.920 that's why you don't want to 00:31:43.920 --> 00:31:44.960 depend too heavily on them 00:31:44.960 --> 00:31:46.450 because they'll break your 00:31:46.450 --> 00:31:46.960 heart. 00:31:46.960 --> 00:31:48.510 I mean, you know, this was the 00:31:48.510 --> 00:31:49.960 problem with centralization, 00:31:49.960 --> 00:31:51.070 is there was no incentive for 00:31:51.070 --> 00:31:52.960 them to listen to us, right? 00:31:52.960 --> 00:31:54.960 And if there's only one Google, 00:31:54.960 --> 00:31:56.240 well, then why should they care 00:31:56.240 --> 00:31:56.960 what we think? 00:31:56.960 --> 00:31:58.080 There is going to be a market 00:31:58.080 --> 00:31:59.410 that kind of evolves where 00:31:59.410 --> 00:32:00.960 people will take either content 00:32:00.960 --> 00:32:02.250 that people are making 00:32:02.250 --> 00:32:04.960 available free and changing, 00:32:04.960 --> 00:32:06.640 and I think companies will try 00:32:06.640 --> 00:32:08.390 to push the boundaries in doing 00:32:08.390 --> 00:32:08.960 that. 00:32:08.960 --> 00:32:10.380 One of the areas I'm concerned 00:32:10.380 --> 00:32:11.960 about is fake blogs, right? 00:32:11.960 --> 00:32:14.210 So companies are doing that, 00:32:14.210 --> 00:32:14.960 right? 00:32:14.960 --> 00:32:17.120 But I can easily see somebody 00:32:17.120 --> 00:32:19.280 creating what I call a fake-f 00:32:19.280 --> 00:32:19.960 ake blog, 00:32:19.960 --> 00:32:21.430 which is basically somebody 00:32:21.430 --> 00:32:23.010 saying, "Well, you know what? I 00:32:23.010 --> 00:32:23.960 don't like Starbucks, 00:32:23.960 --> 00:32:25.620 so I'm going to create a fake 00:32:25.620 --> 00:32:27.580 blog and pretend it's Starbucks 00:32:27.580 --> 00:32:27.960 ." 00:32:27.960 --> 00:32:30.550 I've done one of those. I don't 00:32:30.550 --> 00:32:32.960 want to tell you what it is. 00:32:32.960 --> 00:32:34.590 It hasn't quite percolated 00:32:34.590 --> 00:32:35.960 through Google yet. 00:32:35.960 --> 00:32:38.300 I don't want to tell you what 00:32:38.300 --> 00:32:38.960 it is. I don't want to tell you 00:32:38.960 --> 00:32:38.960 what it is. 00:32:38.960 --> 00:32:39.960 But a fake-fake blog? 00:32:39.960 --> 00:32:40.960 Yeah, I understand the concept. 00:32:40.960 --> 00:32:41.770 You know, where it's like, you 00:32:41.770 --> 00:32:43.280 know, and you might think it's 00:32:43.280 --> 00:32:43.960 the company trying to do that. 00:32:43.960 --> 00:32:45.790 Also, I'm wondering if some of 00:32:45.790 --> 00:32:46.970 these fake blogs are 00:32:46.970 --> 00:32:48.960 intentionally fake, 00:32:48.960 --> 00:32:50.400 because they know it's just 00:32:50.400 --> 00:32:52.320 good PR, not good PR, but they 00:32:52.320 --> 00:32:52.960 know it's bad. 00:32:52.960 --> 00:32:53.960 What do you mean by that? 00:32:53.960 --> 00:32:55.040 Well, like the McDonald's 00:32:55.040 --> 00:32:55.960 Lincoln Park blog. Did you hear 00:32:55.960 --> 00:32:55.960 about that? 00:32:55.960 --> 00:32:56.960 Yeah. 00:32:56.960 --> 00:32:57.960 Okay. 00:32:57.960 --> 00:32:58.960 FCP. 00:32:58.960 --> 00:33:00.660 So I'm wondering if McDonald's 00:33:00.660 --> 00:33:01.700 said, you know, some companies 00:33:01.700 --> 00:33:02.960 believe there's no such thing 00:33:02.960 --> 00:33:03.960 as bad PR. 00:33:03.960 --> 00:33:04.960 Right. 00:33:04.960 --> 00:33:05.980 So they're going to get to 00:33:05.980 --> 00:33:06.960 create online bots. 00:33:06.960 --> 00:33:08.510 So I'm wondering if McDonald's, 00:33:08.510 --> 00:33:09.960 one of two things happened. 00:33:09.960 --> 00:33:10.980 Either they said, "Yeah, we're 00:33:10.980 --> 00:33:11.960 going to do this blog thing. We 00:33:11.960 --> 00:33:11.960 'll do it this way." 00:33:11.960 --> 00:33:12.960 Right. 00:33:12.960 --> 00:33:13.680 And they really were totally 00:33:13.680 --> 00:33:13.960 naive. 00:33:13.960 --> 00:33:14.960 Or. 00:33:14.960 --> 00:33:15.960 Or they were smart as hell. 00:33:15.960 --> 00:33:16.960 Right. 00:33:16.960 --> 00:33:18.170 They said, "They're going to be 00:33:18.170 --> 00:33:19.360 outraged by this, but we'll get 00:33:19.360 --> 00:33:19.960 a lot of orders." 00:33:19.960 --> 00:33:21.430 We'll get all this link up, and 00:33:21.430 --> 00:33:22.960 we'll get all this possible. 00:33:22.960 --> 00:33:24.330 Well, did it work? Did it get 00:33:24.330 --> 00:33:24.960 people to go? 00:33:24.960 --> 00:33:25.960 Got people talking? 00:33:25.960 --> 00:33:26.720 We're talking about it right 00:33:26.720 --> 00:33:26.960 now. 00:33:26.960 --> 00:33:27.960 Yeah, that's right. 00:33:27.960 --> 00:33:28.960 Creep of listening. 00:33:28.960 --> 00:33:30.530 I'm being accused of being a sh 00:33:30.530 --> 00:33:30.960 ill. 00:33:30.960 --> 00:33:32.990 McDonald's has, you know, I've 00:33:32.990 --> 00:33:34.860 written about this a lot when I 00:33:34.860 --> 00:33:35.960 'm traveling. 00:33:35.960 --> 00:33:37.280 You know, McDonald's, this was 00:33:37.280 --> 00:33:37.960 a big secret. 00:33:37.960 --> 00:33:38.730 I put something on my blog and 00:33:38.730 --> 00:33:40.230 said, "Boy, if McDonald's were 00:33:40.230 --> 00:33:41.960 really serious about Wi-Fi, 00:33:41.960 --> 00:33:42.960 you know, they could clean up." 00:33:42.960 --> 00:33:44.170 And then somebody said, "What 00:33:44.170 --> 00:33:44.960 the fuck are you talking about? 00:33:44.960 --> 00:33:46.540 Of course it's serious about Wi 00:33:46.540 --> 00:33:46.960 -Fi. 00:33:46.960 --> 00:33:47.960 Look at the map." 00:33:47.960 --> 00:33:48.660 And so they sent me a board to 00:33:48.660 --> 00:33:48.960 the map. 00:33:48.960 --> 00:33:50.710 And if there aren't, I mean, 00:33:50.710 --> 00:33:52.620 every McDonald's all across the 00:33:52.620 --> 00:33:53.960 country has Wi-Fi. 00:33:53.960 --> 00:33:55.560 So if they wanted to get blog- 00:33:55.560 --> 00:33:57.050 type people interested in 00:33:57.050 --> 00:33:59.140 McDonald's, one simple way to 00:33:59.140 --> 00:33:59.960 do it would be 00:33:59.960 --> 00:34:01.100 to put a little sign on the 00:34:01.100 --> 00:34:02.890 door that says, "Take out your 00:34:02.890 --> 00:34:03.960 laptop and try it out, because 00:34:03.960 --> 00:34:04.960 it works." 00:34:04.960 --> 00:34:06.370 This is like, well, Starbucks 00:34:06.370 --> 00:34:07.740 has become the de facto hangout 00:34:07.740 --> 00:34:07.960 . 00:34:07.960 --> 00:34:08.960 Absolutely. 00:34:08.960 --> 00:34:11.320 Well, yeah, I was, you know, 00:34:11.320 --> 00:34:13.300 Keith Tier, Keith, he did real 00:34:13.300 --> 00:34:13.960 names. 00:34:13.960 --> 00:34:15.870 And sort of Silicon Valley 00:34:15.870 --> 00:34:18.130 entrepreneur started Cyber, 00:34:18.130 --> 00:34:20.030 Siberia, basically the first 00:34:20.030 --> 00:34:20.960 cybercap 00:34:20.960 --> 00:34:23.960 in Britain, in London. 00:34:23.960 --> 00:34:25.430 And, you know, we were talking 00:34:25.430 --> 00:34:26.610 about that the other day and 00:34:26.610 --> 00:34:27.960 basically agreed that this 00:34:27.960 --> 00:34:29.620 is what cybercap plays became, 00:34:29.620 --> 00:34:30.960 is Starbucks, right? 00:34:30.960 --> 00:34:32.320 I mean, you know, it went the 00:34:32.320 --> 00:34:32.960 other way. 00:34:32.960 --> 00:34:34.410 Instead of a new chain, I think 00:34:34.410 --> 00:34:35.960 we'll see more and more of it. 00:34:35.960 --> 00:34:36.960 That's McDonald's. 00:34:36.960 --> 00:34:38.270 I mean, you know, there aren't 00:34:38.270 --> 00:34:38.960 any Starbucks. 00:34:38.960 --> 00:34:39.970 You know, there's Starbucks on 00:34:39.970 --> 00:34:40.960 the two coasts in Chicago. 00:34:40.960 --> 00:34:41.960 And that's it. 00:34:41.960 --> 00:34:43.320 You know, in big cities, there 00:34:43.320 --> 00:34:43.960 's Starbucks. 00:34:43.960 --> 00:34:45.120 But if you're like driving 00:34:45.120 --> 00:34:46.520 cross-country, if you're in 00:34:46.520 --> 00:34:47.960 like a red state somewhere, 00:34:47.960 --> 00:34:47.960 forget 00:34:47.960 --> 00:34:48.960 it. 00:34:48.960 --> 00:34:50.010 McDonald's is like the only 00:34:50.010 --> 00:34:50.960 place that has Wi-Fi. 00:34:50.960 --> 00:34:51.990 And now I have another reason 00:34:51.990 --> 00:34:52.960 not to go to a red state. 00:34:52.960 --> 00:34:53.960 It's no Starbucks. 00:34:53.960 --> 00:34:54.960 No. 00:34:54.960 --> 00:34:55.960 Yeah, right. 00:34:55.960 --> 00:34:56.960 Well, it's true. 00:34:56.960 --> 00:34:58.200 You know, my first cross- 00:34:58.200 --> 00:34:59.940 country trip, driving from Reno, 00:34:59.940 --> 00:35:01.960 Nevada to Denver, Colorado, not 00:35:01.960 --> 00:35:02.960 one Starbucks. 00:35:02.960 --> 00:35:03.960 I got it. 00:35:03.960 --> 00:35:04.960 You win? 00:35:04.960 --> 00:35:05.770 Oh, I drink this stuff every 00:35:05.770 --> 00:35:05.960 day. 00:35:05.960 --> 00:35:06.810 No, you know what the solution 00:35:06.810 --> 00:35:06.960 is? 00:35:06.960 --> 00:35:07.960 No. 00:35:07.960 --> 00:35:08.350 Oh, I think the solution is 00:35:08.350 --> 00:35:08.800 really quite to my big checkery 00:35:08.800 --> 00:35:08.960 . 00:35:08.960 --> 00:35:10.680 There's an answer to this, 00:35:10.680 --> 00:35:12.620 which is McDonald's iced tea, 00:35:12.620 --> 00:35:13.960 unsweet iced tea. 00:35:13.960 --> 00:35:15.960 It's really pretty good. 00:35:15.960 --> 00:35:16.960 It's bloated with caffeine. 00:35:16.960 --> 00:35:17.960 It's very refreshing. 00:35:17.960 --> 00:35:18.960 And it's quite affordable. 00:35:18.960 --> 00:35:19.960 Well, he's an influence. 00:35:19.960 --> 00:35:20.960 So I'm going to try it. 00:35:20.960 --> 00:35:21.960 Yeah. 00:35:21.960 --> 00:35:22.960 It sold me on McDonald's. 00:35:22.960 --> 00:35:23.960 What? 00:35:23.960 --> 00:35:24.960 It sold me on McDonald's. 00:35:24.960 --> 00:35:25.960 It's great. 00:35:25.960 --> 00:35:26.960 I like it better. 00:35:26.960 --> 00:35:29.270 The only problem is you have to 00:35:29.270 --> 00:35:31.960 smell the smell of McDonald's. 00:35:31.960 --> 00:35:32.960 That's the problem. 00:35:32.960 --> 00:35:33.780 You don't want to hang out in a 00:35:33.780 --> 00:35:34.520 McDonald's and put on your 00:35:34.520 --> 00:35:34.960 laptop. 00:35:34.960 --> 00:35:36.590 The Wi-Fi is pretty good, and 00:35:36.590 --> 00:35:37.960 it's $49 a month. 00:35:37.960 --> 00:35:39.960 Do you know if it's greasy? 00:35:39.960 --> 00:35:40.960 Oh, yeah. 00:35:40.960 --> 00:35:43.250 Well, you know, people, what 00:35:43.250 --> 00:35:43.960 was it? 00:35:43.960 --> 00:35:44.950 Madge Weinstein said, "Oh, sure 00:35:44.950 --> 00:35:44.960 . 00:35:44.960 --> 00:35:46.520 We know he's going for the iced 00:35:46.520 --> 00:35:46.960 tea. 00:35:46.960 --> 00:35:47.960 Ha, ha, ha." 00:35:47.960 --> 00:35:49.410 He's, you know, a few quarter-p 00:35:49.410 --> 00:35:50.960 atter with cheese or whatever. 00:35:50.960 --> 00:35:51.960 He never did that. 00:35:51.960 --> 00:35:52.960 I like the chicken selects. 00:35:52.960 --> 00:35:54.170 Gained at least 20 pounds off 00:35:54.170 --> 00:35:54.960 chicken selects. 00:35:54.960 --> 00:35:55.960 I stopped eating that. 00:35:55.960 --> 00:35:56.960 But I don't do that anymore. 00:35:56.960 --> 00:35:57.960 Salads and salmon. 00:35:57.960 --> 00:35:58.960 That's me, you know. 00:35:58.960 --> 00:36:00.650 Yeah, that would be nice if 00:36:00.650 --> 00:36:02.520 they had a chain of restaurants 00:36:02.520 --> 00:36:03.960 where you could go. 00:36:03.960 --> 00:36:05.130 And I don't care if it costs 10 00:36:05.130 --> 00:36:05.960 bucks, you know. 00:36:05.960 --> 00:36:07.340 Have you tried the Verizon, the 00:36:07.340 --> 00:36:08.730 new, like, broadband service 00:36:08.730 --> 00:36:09.960 they have in the cities? 00:36:09.960 --> 00:36:10.960 I don't know about that. 00:36:10.960 --> 00:36:11.960 They have a city. 00:36:11.960 --> 00:36:14.970 They now offer up to $600K 00:36:14.970 --> 00:36:18.540 first in, like, 15 major cities 00:36:18.540 --> 00:36:18.960 . 00:36:18.960 --> 00:36:19.960 $80 bucks. 00:36:19.960 --> 00:36:20.960 Give it to you. 00:36:20.960 --> 00:36:21.960 $80 bucks for what? 00:36:21.960 --> 00:36:22.960 $80 bucks a month. 00:36:22.960 --> 00:36:23.960 Flat. 00:36:23.960 --> 00:36:24.960 Where do you get access? 00:36:24.960 --> 00:36:25.960 Anywhere. 00:36:25.960 --> 00:36:26.960 Anywhere. 00:36:26.960 --> 00:36:27.960 The whole city. 00:36:27.960 --> 00:36:28.620 It's a card you plug in your 00:36:28.620 --> 00:36:28.960 notebook. 00:36:28.960 --> 00:36:29.960 Oh, really? 00:36:29.960 --> 00:36:30.960 Yeah. 00:36:30.960 --> 00:36:31.740 Again, I hate to plug Jason Cal 00:36:31.740 --> 00:36:32.560 canis twice in one podcast, but 00:36:32.560 --> 00:36:32.960 he has it. 00:36:32.960 --> 00:36:33.960 Sure. 00:36:33.960 --> 00:36:34.960 He raves about it. 00:36:34.960 --> 00:36:35.960 He's got me wanting it so bad. 00:36:35.960 --> 00:36:36.960 Because I want to post. 00:36:36.960 --> 00:36:37.960 But it's $600K. 00:36:37.960 --> 00:36:38.820 So is it a cellular modem thing 00:36:38.820 --> 00:36:38.960 ? 00:36:38.960 --> 00:36:39.960 Yeah, it's a cellular modem. 00:36:39.960 --> 00:36:40.960 Yeah. 00:36:40.960 --> 00:36:41.960 Oh, really? 00:36:41.960 --> 00:36:42.960 Yeah. 00:36:42.960 --> 00:36:43.960 And it's how much a month? 00:36:43.960 --> 00:36:44.960 $80. 00:36:44.960 --> 00:36:45.960 $80. 00:36:45.960 --> 00:36:48.960 It's only a major city, so. 00:36:48.960 --> 00:36:50.960 On top of a $30 Wi-Fi canada. 00:36:50.960 --> 00:36:51.960 On top of what? 00:36:51.960 --> 00:36:53.560 On top of a $30 a month Wi-Fi 00:36:53.560 --> 00:36:55.180 canada, which I have here with 00:36:55.180 --> 00:36:55.960 T-Mobile. 00:36:55.960 --> 00:36:57.440 But why would you even need 00:36:57.440 --> 00:36:57.960 that? 00:36:57.960 --> 00:36:59.700 Well, you locked in for a while 00:36:59.700 --> 00:36:59.960 . 00:36:59.960 --> 00:37:00.930 Well, and then you wouldn't 00:37:00.930 --> 00:37:01.860 need it at home either if you 00:37:01.860 --> 00:37:02.960 live in that area, right? 00:37:02.960 --> 00:37:03.960 Yes. 00:37:03.960 --> 00:37:04.550 Although it doesn't go all the 00:37:04.550 --> 00:37:04.960 way up, right? 00:37:04.960 --> 00:37:05.960 I would have to stick some. 00:37:05.960 --> 00:37:07.660 You know, they have a Wi-Fi at 00:37:07.660 --> 00:37:08.960 Brian Park, right? 00:37:08.960 --> 00:37:09.960 Yes. 00:37:09.960 --> 00:37:10.960 Yeah. 00:37:10.960 --> 00:37:11.960 All over the place. 00:37:11.960 --> 00:37:12.960 Yeah. 00:37:12.960 --> 00:37:13.960 All over the place. 00:37:13.960 --> 00:37:14.680 So if I wanted to go, I'd save 00:37:14.680 --> 00:37:15.540 six bucks instead of uploading 00:37:15.540 --> 00:37:15.960 this podcast. 00:37:15.960 --> 00:37:16.960 I mean, I'm going to upload 00:37:16.960 --> 00:37:18.060 this podcast right after we're 00:37:18.060 --> 00:37:18.960 done, basically. 00:37:18.960 --> 00:37:20.780 You know, so it's like going to 00:37:20.780 --> 00:37:22.740 be instant broadcast journalism 00:37:22.740 --> 00:37:22.960 . 00:37:22.960 --> 00:37:24.960 You're a media star now, Steve. 00:37:24.960 --> 00:37:25.960 I am? 00:37:25.960 --> 00:37:26.960 How do you feel about that? 00:37:26.960 --> 00:37:27.960 That's scary. 00:37:27.960 --> 00:37:29.960 This guy, Mike is the star. 00:37:29.960 --> 00:37:30.960 Yeah, Mike is. 00:37:30.960 --> 00:37:31.960 I've done like 20 interviews. 00:37:31.960 --> 00:37:32.960 You've done over 100. 00:37:32.960 --> 00:37:33.960 I've done so many. 00:37:33.960 --> 00:37:34.960 It's crazy. 00:37:34.960 --> 00:37:36.200 But isn't it a lot that the 00:37:36.200 --> 00:37:37.370 media want to talk to a PR 00:37:37.370 --> 00:37:37.960 person? 00:37:37.960 --> 00:37:39.860 I mean, that the media want to 00:37:39.860 --> 00:37:40.960 interview a PR person. 00:37:40.960 --> 00:37:41.960 Yeah. 00:37:41.960 --> 00:37:42.960 I mean, it's just irony. 00:37:42.960 --> 00:37:43.960 Who? 00:37:43.960 --> 00:37:44.960 Well. 00:37:44.960 --> 00:37:45.650 Who wants to interview a PR 00:37:45.650 --> 00:37:45.960 person? 00:37:45.960 --> 00:37:46.560 Well, I've done a lot of 00:37:46.560 --> 00:37:46.960 interviews. 00:37:46.960 --> 00:37:47.960 Oh, you do? 00:37:47.960 --> 00:37:48.960 That's true. 00:37:48.960 --> 00:37:49.960 I did four just this week. 00:37:49.960 --> 00:37:51.210 Isn't that a conflict of 00:37:51.210 --> 00:37:51.960 interest? 00:37:51.960 --> 00:37:52.960 Not yet. 00:37:52.960 --> 00:37:53.960 I'm actually able to. 00:37:53.960 --> 00:37:55.740 It's getting close to that, huh 00:37:55.740 --> 00:37:55.960 ? 00:37:55.960 --> 00:37:57.960 No, because I've moved now. 00:37:57.960 --> 00:37:59.420 But isn't your job to try to 00:37:59.420 --> 00:38:00.950 get in those interviews for 00:38:00.950 --> 00:38:01.960 your clients? 00:38:01.960 --> 00:38:03.380 Aren't you competing with your 00:38:03.380 --> 00:38:03.960 clients? 00:38:03.960 --> 00:38:05.890 Not anymore, because I'm now 00:38:05.890 --> 00:38:06.960 working now. 00:38:06.960 --> 00:38:10.320 I would say, I would say 80% of 00:38:10.320 --> 00:38:12.280 my job now is to work with 00:38:12.280 --> 00:38:14.530 clients on blogging and 00:38:14.530 --> 00:38:14.960 strategies 00:38:14.960 --> 00:38:16.750 and also building a whole side 00:38:16.750 --> 00:38:17.960 of our business. 00:38:17.960 --> 00:38:19.200 So by becoming more of a 00:38:19.200 --> 00:38:20.960 visible expert on this stuff, 00:38:20.960 --> 00:38:22.390 you're helping generate 00:38:22.390 --> 00:38:22.960 business 00:38:22.960 --> 00:38:23.960 for your firm. 00:38:23.960 --> 00:38:24.960 Exactly. 00:38:24.960 --> 00:38:26.000 Which is exactly what you're 00:38:26.000 --> 00:38:27.070 saying to your clients is that 00:38:27.070 --> 00:38:27.960 by becoming an expert in your 00:38:27.960 --> 00:38:29.870 own area, by letting everybody 00:38:29.870 --> 00:38:31.400 know that you know the most 00:38:31.400 --> 00:38:32.960 about whatever it is that 00:38:32.960 --> 00:38:34.210 you do, that that just can't 00:38:34.210 --> 00:38:35.580 help but help your business, 00:38:35.580 --> 00:38:35.960 right? 00:38:35.960 --> 00:38:36.960 I wouldn't say I know the most. 00:38:36.960 --> 00:38:38.460 I think I learn from the people 00:38:38.460 --> 00:38:38.960 who do. 00:38:38.960 --> 00:38:40.800 But I don't know any other blog 00:38:40.800 --> 00:38:41.960 ging PR person. 00:38:41.960 --> 00:38:42.960 You're the only one I know. 00:38:42.960 --> 00:38:44.960 There are 140 of them. 00:38:44.960 --> 00:38:46.110 I understand, but I'm telling 00:38:46.110 --> 00:38:47.260 you, it's not getting any easy 00:38:47.260 --> 00:38:47.960 data, Steve. 00:38:47.960 --> 00:38:49.670 And I'm sure you're aware of 00:38:49.670 --> 00:38:50.960 that too, right? 00:38:50.960 --> 00:38:52.690 Yes, but I want to give them a 00:38:52.690 --> 00:38:54.370 plug, because I think that 00:38:54.370 --> 00:38:55.960 there are a lot of good PR blog 00:38:55.960 --> 00:38:55.960 gers 00:38:55.960 --> 00:38:57.440 out there who are out there 00:38:57.440 --> 00:38:59.120 long before I was from all over 00:38:59.120 --> 00:38:59.960 the world. 00:38:59.960 --> 00:39:01.110 I mean, Neville Hopson out of 00:39:01.110 --> 00:39:02.130 Amsterdam, if you're not 00:39:02.130 --> 00:39:03.750 reading his blog, it's fabulous 00:39:03.750 --> 00:39:03.960 . 00:39:03.960 --> 00:39:04.960 He's talking about-- 00:39:04.960 --> 00:39:06.210 Well, I read your blog, and I 00:39:06.210 --> 00:39:07.460 expect you to point to him when 00:39:07.460 --> 00:39:08.960 he has something interesting. 00:39:08.960 --> 00:39:09.960 I do, I definitely do. 00:39:09.960 --> 00:39:10.960 What about a link blog? 00:39:10.960 --> 00:39:11.580 Do you ever think about doing 00:39:11.580 --> 00:39:11.960 one of those? 00:39:11.960 --> 00:39:13.400 I have thought about doing that 00:39:13.400 --> 00:39:13.960 , because-- 00:39:13.960 --> 00:39:15.050 Because you ask what's next for 00:39:15.050 --> 00:39:15.960 me, that's one of them. 00:39:15.960 --> 00:39:17.300 That's another thing OPML is 00:39:17.300 --> 00:39:17.960 good for. 00:39:17.960 --> 00:39:19.810 Is that, you know, if you want 00:39:19.810 --> 00:39:21.460 to do a more sort of like long 00:39:21.460 --> 00:39:22.960 post, short post sort of thing, 00:39:22.960 --> 00:39:24.580 and a lot easier, that's one of 00:39:24.580 --> 00:39:25.960 the things I want to do. 00:39:25.960 --> 00:39:27.530 I think that blogging has 00:39:27.530 --> 00:39:28.960 gotten too in a rut. 00:39:28.960 --> 00:39:30.750 I have a link blog now, kind of 00:39:30.750 --> 00:39:32.850 , for delicious, which is 00:39:32.850 --> 00:39:34.660 basically, yeah, it's my backup 00:39:34.660 --> 00:39:34.960 brain. 00:39:34.960 --> 00:39:36.110 I mean, if I see a laptop, I 00:39:36.110 --> 00:39:37.410 think I want to buy, I'll throw 00:39:37.410 --> 00:39:37.960 it there. 00:39:37.960 --> 00:39:40.120 But actually, something I've 00:39:40.120 --> 00:39:42.150 actually done is I'm using 00:39:42.150 --> 00:39:45.960 delicious, the irony is, where 00:39:45.960 --> 00:39:45.960 I sit, 00:39:45.960 --> 00:39:49.960 is I now get pitched a lot. 00:39:49.960 --> 00:39:50.960 You get pitched. 00:39:50.960 --> 00:39:51.960 I get pitched. 00:39:51.960 --> 00:39:53.340 Which is weird, because you're 00:39:53.340 --> 00:39:53.960 a pitcher. 00:39:53.960 --> 00:39:56.930 It's like, years ago there was 00:39:56.930 --> 00:39:59.960 Bill and Ted's bogus journey, 00:39:59.960 --> 00:40:00.960 it's a B movie. 00:40:00.960 --> 00:40:02.800 And it was a scene where Bill 00:40:02.800 --> 00:40:04.890 and Ted were sent to their own 00:40:04.890 --> 00:40:05.960 personal hell. 00:40:05.960 --> 00:40:07.570 Okay, and that's what I feel 00:40:07.570 --> 00:40:08.920 like, because all these years 00:40:08.920 --> 00:40:09.960 of pitching journalists 00:40:09.960 --> 00:40:11.960 and spamming their own biases. 00:40:11.960 --> 00:40:13.530 Now I'm getting spammed by 00:40:13.530 --> 00:40:15.200 other PR professionals and the 00:40:15.200 --> 00:40:15.960 tables have turned. 00:40:15.960 --> 00:40:16.960 You're a filter. 00:40:16.960 --> 00:40:18.240 Well, like, and some of it's 00:40:18.240 --> 00:40:18.960 really good. 00:40:18.960 --> 00:40:20.960 And I'm trying to be nice. 00:40:20.960 --> 00:40:22.080 I try to respond to every pitch 00:40:22.080 --> 00:40:22.960 and try to say thank you. 00:40:22.960 --> 00:40:23.960 At least just say thank you. 00:40:23.960 --> 00:40:25.960 But what I've done is, I say, 00:40:25.960 --> 00:40:27.570 hey, let's make the pitching 00:40:27.570 --> 00:40:28.960 process transparent. 00:40:28.960 --> 00:40:30.270 Go put your link up in 00:40:30.270 --> 00:40:32.650 delicious and tag it micro 00:40:32.650 --> 00:40:33.960 persuasion. 00:40:33.960 --> 00:40:35.810 And tell me one line why you 00:40:35.810 --> 00:40:37.960 think I should link to this. 00:40:37.960 --> 00:40:39.440 Have you asked people to do 00:40:39.440 --> 00:40:39.960 that? 00:40:39.960 --> 00:40:40.960 Yeah. 00:40:40.960 --> 00:40:41.960 And what do they do? 00:40:41.960 --> 00:40:43.390 Some have actually taken to it 00:40:43.390 --> 00:40:44.630 and started to post things 00:40:44.630 --> 00:40:44.960 there. 00:40:44.960 --> 00:40:46.010 And I try to pull things from 00:40:46.010 --> 00:40:47.110 there regularly that I think 00:40:47.110 --> 00:40:47.960 are appropriate. 00:40:47.960 --> 00:40:50.000 So it's a public place, 00:40:50.000 --> 00:40:50.960 basically. 00:40:50.960 --> 00:40:51.920 You could point to that from 00:40:51.920 --> 00:40:52.960 your blog if you wanted to. 00:40:52.960 --> 00:40:53.960 Yeah, I do. 00:40:53.960 --> 00:40:54.750 So you'd have a sort of, or you 00:40:54.750 --> 00:40:54.960 do. 00:40:54.960 --> 00:40:56.140 And so there would be a place 00:40:56.140 --> 00:40:57.440 that basically anybody could 00:40:57.440 --> 00:40:57.960 post to. 00:40:57.960 --> 00:41:00.960 That's transparent pitching. 00:41:00.960 --> 00:41:02.260 Well, it's sort of like, there 00:41:02.260 --> 00:41:03.540 's so many things like the track 00:41:03.540 --> 00:41:03.960 back. 00:41:03.960 --> 00:41:05.010 If you had, you know, that's 00:41:05.010 --> 00:41:06.650 kind of like track back, except 00:41:06.650 --> 00:41:09.960 in a sort of centralized place. 00:41:09.960 --> 00:41:11.370 Well, it's an invitation saying 00:41:11.370 --> 00:41:12.960 , you know, post something here. 00:41:12.960 --> 00:41:14.960 I promise you I'll look at it. 00:41:14.960 --> 00:41:16.680 And then if I, it sounds 00:41:16.680 --> 00:41:17.960 interesting. 00:41:17.960 --> 00:41:19.720 There's something I want to ask 00:41:19.720 --> 00:41:19.960 . 00:41:19.960 --> 00:41:20.960 Is there sort of like, 00:41:20.960 --> 00:41:21.840 Is this the question you were 00:41:21.840 --> 00:41:22.460 going to ask me at the 00:41:22.460 --> 00:41:22.960 beginning? 00:41:22.960 --> 00:41:24.110 No, and I was going to put it 00:41:24.110 --> 00:41:25.960 out to all these guys. 00:41:25.960 --> 00:41:28.110 Is that, is there like a pulse 00:41:28.110 --> 00:41:29.850 to the New York bloggers 00:41:29.850 --> 00:41:30.960 community? 00:41:30.960 --> 00:41:31.960 Do you have meetups? 00:41:31.960 --> 00:41:33.490 Do you have, is there anybody 00:41:33.490 --> 00:41:34.480 who throws parties or anything 00:41:34.480 --> 00:41:34.960 like that? 00:41:34.960 --> 00:41:35.960 No. 00:41:35.960 --> 00:41:36.960 Cause like in San Francisco, 00:41:36.960 --> 00:41:38.710 there's a whole sort of circuit 00:41:38.710 --> 00:41:38.960 . 00:41:38.960 --> 00:41:39.960 There's no time for that. 00:41:39.960 --> 00:41:41.570 There's no, you gotta catch a 00:41:41.570 --> 00:41:41.960 train. 00:41:41.960 --> 00:41:42.960 You gotta. 00:41:42.960 --> 00:41:44.430 I'm not saying it's a good 00:41:44.430 --> 00:41:44.960 thing, actually. 00:41:44.960 --> 00:41:46.640 Cause I think it's very incest 00:41:46.640 --> 00:41:46.960 uous. 00:41:46.960 --> 00:41:48.190 And people are so concerned 00:41:48.190 --> 00:41:49.590 about being friends with other 00:41:49.590 --> 00:41:50.960 people that, you know, 00:41:50.960 --> 00:41:52.530 they're not getting any truth 00:41:52.530 --> 00:41:54.290 anymore because you gotta, you 00:41:54.290 --> 00:41:54.960 know, be careful. 00:41:54.960 --> 00:41:56.960 So is there anything like that? 00:41:56.960 --> 00:41:57.960 I've been pushing for it. 00:41:57.960 --> 00:41:58.960 I've been trying to, you know, 00:41:58.960 --> 00:41:59.960 connect with different people. 00:41:59.960 --> 00:42:00.670 You know, I reached out to 00:42:00.670 --> 00:42:00.960 Steve. 00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:02.160 That's why we're here this 00:42:02.160 --> 00:42:03.340 morning, you know, let's get 00:42:03.340 --> 00:42:03.960 together. 00:42:03.960 --> 00:42:05.340 I got together with Jason and 00:42:05.340 --> 00:42:06.960 some of his bloggers one night, 00:42:06.960 --> 00:42:07.960 two weeks ago. 00:42:07.960 --> 00:42:08.960 Six Apart was here. 00:42:08.960 --> 00:42:10.760 They actually had a, you know, 00:42:10.760 --> 00:42:11.960 drinks last week. 00:42:11.960 --> 00:42:12.960 I was too sick to go. 00:42:12.960 --> 00:42:13.960 They had a what week? 00:42:13.960 --> 00:42:15.960 They sort of like, you know, 00:42:15.960 --> 00:42:19.960 open, what is it, happy hour. 00:42:19.960 --> 00:42:20.960 Six Apart was here. 00:42:20.960 --> 00:42:22.630 Meina came into town and, you 00:42:22.630 --> 00:42:24.330 know, Anil and Nate, they had 00:42:24.330 --> 00:42:25.590 an open house basically for 00:42:25.590 --> 00:42:25.960 bloggers. 00:42:25.960 --> 00:42:27.370 And, but no, we really need 00:42:27.370 --> 00:42:28.960 some sort of formal way because 00:42:28.960 --> 00:42:28.960 . 00:42:28.960 --> 00:42:30.520 Well, here's the thing, you 00:42:30.520 --> 00:42:32.960 know, I think that New York is 00:42:32.960 --> 00:42:33.960 very, as you know, Dave, 00:42:33.960 --> 00:42:35.340 it's very different in the 00:42:35.340 --> 00:42:35.960 valley. 00:42:35.960 --> 00:42:37.640 I mean, it's, it's, it tends to 00:42:37.640 --> 00:42:37.960 be. 00:42:37.960 --> 00:42:39.610 It's not really a community, is 00:42:39.610 --> 00:42:39.960 it? 00:42:39.960 --> 00:42:40.960 It's so huge. 00:42:40.960 --> 00:42:42.030 And here's how we see it like 00:42:42.030 --> 00:42:42.960 with on the PR side. 00:42:42.960 --> 00:42:44.690 When we go into a media tour, 00:42:44.690 --> 00:42:45.920 we're a client out in 00:42:45.920 --> 00:42:46.960 California. 00:42:46.960 --> 00:42:48.400 Don't meet, the media world 00:42:48.400 --> 00:42:49.960 will meet with the clients. 00:42:49.960 --> 00:42:51.410 In New York, they really don't 00:42:51.410 --> 00:42:51.960 want to. 00:42:51.960 --> 00:42:53.570 Unless it's such a big name or 00:42:53.570 --> 00:42:55.130 has such a value for them or 00:42:55.130 --> 00:42:56.960 they really have the time to do 00:42:56.960 --> 00:42:56.960 it. 00:42:56.960 --> 00:42:59.960 It's a very different vibe. 00:42:59.960 --> 00:43:01.820 That's changed because in the 00:43:01.820 --> 00:43:03.200 80s, I did press tours that 00:43:03.200 --> 00:43:04.960 came through New York, Boston, 00:43:04.960 --> 00:43:06.500 Philadelphia, Washington and so 00:43:06.500 --> 00:43:06.960 forth. 00:43:06.960 --> 00:43:08.750 And yeah, I mean, they would 00:43:08.750 --> 00:43:10.020 card me around all the 00:43:10.020 --> 00:43:11.470 publications and yeah, they 00:43:11.470 --> 00:43:11.960 would meet. 00:43:11.960 --> 00:43:13.010 I didn't think there was a 00:43:13.010 --> 00:43:13.960 whole lot of value. 00:43:13.960 --> 00:43:14.960 It's hard. 00:43:14.960 --> 00:43:16.170 We can get the meetings, but it 00:43:16.170 --> 00:43:16.960 's a lot harder. 00:43:16.960 --> 00:43:18.960 I think that's rashes. 00:43:18.960 --> 00:43:20.280 Because now you can find out 00:43:20.280 --> 00:43:21.530 what you need to know on the 00:43:21.530 --> 00:43:21.960 web. 00:43:21.960 --> 00:43:22.960 I'll go to your website. 00:43:22.960 --> 00:43:23.960 I'll send you an email. 00:43:23.960 --> 00:43:25.600 You send me a copy of the 00:43:25.600 --> 00:43:27.650 software to find out why I'll 00:43:27.650 --> 00:43:28.960 play with it. 00:43:28.960 --> 00:43:29.960 It's different. 00:43:29.960 --> 00:43:30.960 Yeah. 00:43:30.960 --> 00:43:31.960 Well, I guess that's good. 00:43:31.960 --> 00:43:33.960 Things have changed. 00:43:33.960 --> 00:43:35.880 But one of the things I noticed 00:43:35.880 --> 00:43:37.160 , I spent a bunch of time in 00:43:37.160 --> 00:43:39.620 North Carolina and in Greens 00:43:39.620 --> 00:43:39.960 boro, 00:43:39.960 --> 00:43:41.480 they've got a blogging 00:43:41.480 --> 00:43:43.560 community and it is very much 00:43:43.560 --> 00:43:44.960 based on face-to-face. 00:43:44.960 --> 00:43:47.430 And one of the big differences, 00:43:47.430 --> 00:43:48.990 and I said this when I was 00:43:48.990 --> 00:43:50.960 meeting with people there, 00:43:50.960 --> 00:43:52.810 it occurred to me that there 00:43:52.810 --> 00:43:54.570 may be more bloggers in New 00:43:54.570 --> 00:43:54.960 York, 00:43:54.960 --> 00:43:56.700 but a blogger in Greensboro 00:43:56.700 --> 00:43:58.670 more likely knows another blog 00:43:58.670 --> 00:44:00.420 ger than a blogger in New York 00:44:00.420 --> 00:44:00.960 does. 00:44:00.960 --> 00:44:03.210 You may know them not geograph 00:44:03.210 --> 00:44:06.390 ically, but you've met and your 00:44:06.390 --> 00:44:08.230 friends, you grew up with them 00:44:08.230 --> 00:44:08.960 basically. 00:44:08.960 --> 00:44:10.280 I haven't met many New York 00:44:10.280 --> 00:44:10.960 bloggers. 00:44:10.960 --> 00:44:11.960 Have you? 00:44:11.960 --> 00:44:12.820 Yeah, I've met a bunch actually 00:44:12.820 --> 00:44:12.960 . 00:44:12.960 --> 00:44:14.490 At different events, the blog 00:44:14.490 --> 00:44:15.960 ger dinner where I met you. 00:44:15.960 --> 00:44:16.960 That's right. 00:44:16.960 --> 00:44:17.960 I started meeting people. 00:44:17.960 --> 00:44:19.490 The thing is, blogging is a 00:44:19.490 --> 00:44:20.960 solitary occupation. 00:44:20.960 --> 00:44:22.960 We sit there and we're writers. 00:44:22.960 --> 00:44:23.940 You sit there and you have to 00:44:23.940 --> 00:44:25.960 spend the time researching. 00:44:25.960 --> 00:44:27.330 Dave, you're very prolific, but 00:44:27.330 --> 00:44:29.300 to me, it's the time I spend 00:44:29.300 --> 00:44:29.960 alone. 00:44:29.960 --> 00:44:31.770 Usually late at night, after 00:44:31.770 --> 00:44:32.960 the kids are in bed, writing. 00:44:32.960 --> 00:44:34.790 I love this, seeing you meeting 00:44:34.790 --> 00:44:36.370 other people and discussing 00:44:36.370 --> 00:44:36.960 stuff. 00:44:36.960 --> 00:44:38.960 I think it's exciting. 00:44:38.960 --> 00:44:40.630 Yeah, I usually don't want 00:44:40.630 --> 00:44:42.250 anything to do with meeting 00:44:42.250 --> 00:44:42.960 people. 00:44:42.960 --> 00:44:44.560 This is actually the first time 00:44:44.560 --> 00:44:45.960 I've ever met a blogger. 00:44:45.960 --> 00:44:47.390 He's constantly trying to drag 00:44:47.390 --> 00:44:47.960 me along. 00:44:47.960 --> 00:44:49.960 So what do you think? 00:44:49.960 --> 00:44:51.460 Is it good to meet other blog 00:44:51.460 --> 00:44:51.960 gers? 00:44:51.960 --> 00:44:54.610 Did you hate every second of it 00:44:54.610 --> 00:44:54.960 ? 00:44:54.960 --> 00:44:56.950 It's sort of neat to see the 00:44:56.950 --> 00:44:59.450 person behind the words, which 00:44:59.450 --> 00:45:00.960 is sort of neat. 00:45:00.960 --> 00:45:02.960 I don't know. 00:45:02.960 --> 00:45:04.960 Not every week. 00:45:04.960 --> 00:45:06.500 The people who really are 00:45:06.500 --> 00:45:08.250 social butterflies and they 00:45:08.250 --> 00:45:10.960 just want to meet everybody. 00:45:10.960 --> 00:45:12.960 I just want to blog. 00:45:12.960 --> 00:45:13.800 I want to spend my time on that 00:45:13.800 --> 00:45:13.960 . 00:45:13.960 --> 00:45:14.820 If you have something 00:45:14.820 --> 00:45:15.960 interesting, email me. 00:45:15.960 --> 00:45:17.960 We'll go from there. 00:45:17.960 --> 00:45:19.960 The community is online. 00:45:19.960 --> 00:45:20.960 It's not. 00:45:20.960 --> 00:45:22.500 Next week, I'm coming back to 00:45:22.500 --> 00:45:24.910 New York to do a debate at Re 00:45:24.910 --> 00:45:25.960 uters. 00:45:25.960 --> 00:45:27.130 They're inviting all these 00:45:27.130 --> 00:45:27.960 press people in. 00:45:27.960 --> 00:45:28.960 It's so fascinating. 00:45:28.960 --> 00:45:31.050 This is another reason we get 00:45:31.050 --> 00:45:33.310 together is to help assuage the 00:45:33.310 --> 00:45:35.960 fears of the print journalists. 00:45:35.960 --> 00:45:37.950 All the questions they ask are 00:45:37.950 --> 00:45:38.960 so revealing. 00:45:38.960 --> 00:45:41.040 They want us to say, "No, you 00:45:41.040 --> 00:45:42.960 can't trust bloggers." 00:45:42.960 --> 00:45:44.240 They'll always be a reason for 00:45:44.240 --> 00:45:44.960 you to exist. 00:45:44.960 --> 00:45:47.960 Bloggers have access to Brian. 00:45:47.960 --> 00:45:49.650 Bloggers have confidence to 00:45:49.650 --> 00:45:50.960 entrust whatever. 00:45:50.960 --> 00:45:52.730 There will be, I think, a lot 00:45:52.730 --> 00:45:53.960 of press people. 00:45:53.960 --> 00:45:55.310 I know people are flying in for 00:45:55.310 --> 00:45:55.960 that thing. 00:45:55.960 --> 00:45:57.960 It should be interesting. 00:45:57.960 --> 00:46:00.370 I used to do scripting news din 00:46:00.370 --> 00:46:01.960 ners in New York. 00:46:01.960 --> 00:46:03.560 I've probably done maybe five 00:46:03.560 --> 00:46:04.960 of them over the years. 00:46:04.960 --> 00:46:06.370 We almost got one together for 00:46:06.370 --> 00:46:06.960 this one. 00:46:06.960 --> 00:46:08.980 I don't know who would show up 00:46:08.980 --> 00:46:09.960 for it now. 00:46:09.960 --> 00:46:11.990 Actually, I actually think you 00:46:11.990 --> 00:46:13.960 could have the opposite problem 00:46:13.960 --> 00:46:13.960 . 00:46:13.960 --> 00:46:14.960 So many people show up. 00:46:14.960 --> 00:46:15.960 How do you manage that? 00:46:15.960 --> 00:46:16.680 I don't have a problem with 00:46:16.680 --> 00:46:16.960 that. 00:46:16.960 --> 00:46:18.460 Katz's Deli is very good for 00:46:18.460 --> 00:46:18.960 that. 00:46:18.960 --> 00:46:20.960 Katz has this huge dining room. 00:46:20.960 --> 00:46:22.880 At worst, we'd fill up a tiny 00:46:22.880 --> 00:46:24.960 corner of that dining room. 00:46:24.960 --> 00:46:26.960 That's not the problem. 00:46:26.960 --> 00:46:28.970 I have no idea who would show 00:46:28.970 --> 00:46:29.960 up anymore. 00:46:29.960 --> 00:46:31.960 I try to be there when I can. 00:46:31.960 --> 00:46:34.960 No, I'm sure you would. 00:46:34.960 --> 00:46:37.960 Maybe next time. 00:46:37.960 --> 00:46:40.670 The one I liked the best that I 00:46:40.670 --> 00:46:41.960 've ever done 00:46:41.960 --> 00:46:43.720 was the brunch we did in 00:46:43.720 --> 00:46:44.960 Alexandria. 00:46:44.960 --> 00:46:47.960 We had our own private room 00:46:47.960 --> 00:46:50.160 and 10 people at the really 00:46:50.160 --> 00:46:50.960 long table 00:46:50.960 --> 00:46:52.960 and the door closed. 00:46:52.960 --> 00:46:54.960 We could hear everything. 00:46:54.960 --> 00:46:57.970 Whereas contrast that to one 00:46:57.970 --> 00:46:58.960 that I did in Amsterdam 00:46:58.960 --> 00:47:01.290 where we were 10 people sitting 00:47:01.290 --> 00:47:01.960 at one long table 00:47:01.960 --> 00:47:03.360 and I couldn't hear what the 00:47:03.360 --> 00:47:04.540 guy sitting next to me was 00:47:04.540 --> 00:47:04.960 saying. 00:47:04.960 --> 00:47:06.960 What's the point? 00:47:06.960 --> 00:47:08.960 I mean, okay. 00:47:08.960 --> 00:47:11.960 It was like I moved my mouth. 00:47:11.960 --> 00:47:14.960 What did he say? 00:47:14.960 --> 00:47:16.960 I actually have to go run. 00:47:16.960 --> 00:47:17.960 We've got 44 minutes. 00:47:17.960 --> 00:47:19.960 Don't run yet. 00:47:19.960 --> 00:47:21.960 Let me wrap this up. 00:47:21.960 --> 00:47:24.440 Before you go, we've got to 00:47:24.440 --> 00:47:24.960 talk Dave into gnomedex. 00:47:24.960 --> 00:47:27.960 Yes, we've got to go. 00:47:27.960 --> 00:47:30.420 Before you leave, I just want 00:47:30.420 --> 00:47:31.960 to get a chance to wrap up. 00:47:31.960 --> 00:47:34.220 So don't just walk out and make 00:47:34.220 --> 00:47:34.960 me wrap up by myself. 00:47:34.960 --> 00:47:38.110 I would love to go to gnomedex, 00:47:38.110 --> 00:47:39.960 but Chris has got to invite me 00:47:39.960 --> 00:47:40.960 to speak. 00:47:40.960 --> 00:47:42.960 This is one of the things that 00:47:42.960 --> 00:47:42.960 ... 00:47:42.960 --> 00:47:45.960 Or let's do an open session 00:47:45.960 --> 00:47:48.860 that's an unconference blogger 00:47:48.860 --> 00:47:49.960 style thing. 00:47:49.960 --> 00:47:51.210 I've written about this. Two 00:47:51.210 --> 00:47:51.960 tier conferences. 00:47:51.960 --> 00:47:53.960 I don't like those. 00:47:53.960 --> 00:47:57.960 I would love to go to gnomedex. 00:47:57.960 --> 00:47:59.990 But I would also like to get 00:47:59.990 --> 00:48:00.960 invited. 00:48:00.960 --> 00:48:02.960 I thought seriously about going 00:48:02.960 --> 00:48:04.660 , but I haven't gotten invited 00:48:04.660 --> 00:48:04.960 to it. 00:48:04.960 --> 00:48:06.560 And I see him inviting all 00:48:06.560 --> 00:48:07.960 kinds of other people. 00:48:07.960 --> 00:48:10.400 You paid? Maybe I should just 00:48:10.400 --> 00:48:10.960 pay. 00:48:10.960 --> 00:48:12.380 Maybe I should just fuck the 00:48:12.380 --> 00:48:13.960 hell with getting invited. 00:48:13.960 --> 00:48:15.960 Mark Cantor, filter out. 00:48:15.960 --> 00:48:17.960 I want to meet filter out. 00:48:17.960 --> 00:48:20.960 You think Mark Cantor is like 00:48:20.960 --> 00:48:20.960 ... 00:48:20.960 --> 00:48:24.410 He's a nut. I knew him in the 00:48:24.410 --> 00:48:25.960 SPA years ago. 00:48:25.960 --> 00:48:28.960 He's doing crazy stuff. 00:48:28.960 --> 00:48:30.200 So you would fly across country 00:48:30.200 --> 00:48:30.960 to see Mark Cantor. 00:48:30.960 --> 00:48:32.470 Well, the group, the combined 00:48:32.470 --> 00:48:32.960 group. 00:48:32.960 --> 00:48:33.960 Steve's there. 00:48:33.960 --> 00:48:34.960 Scobal. 00:48:34.960 --> 00:48:36.960 Yeah, Scobal's okay. 00:48:36.960 --> 00:48:38.130 What do you think about the 00:48:38.130 --> 00:48:38.960 podcast hotel? 00:48:38.960 --> 00:48:39.960 Have you heard about that one? 00:48:39.960 --> 00:48:40.960 No. 00:48:40.960 --> 00:48:42.570 I swear they got this one from 00:48:42.570 --> 00:48:42.960 me. 00:48:42.960 --> 00:48:44.960 I did this in a podcast. 00:48:44.960 --> 00:48:46.300 I explained this idea. I've had 00:48:46.300 --> 00:48:46.960 it for years. 00:48:46.960 --> 00:48:47.800 The idea is that we all go 00:48:47.800 --> 00:48:49.960 check and do a hotel somewhere. 00:48:49.960 --> 00:48:51.960 I mean, like 20 or 30 people. 00:48:51.960 --> 00:48:53.960 And we stay there for a week 00:48:53.960 --> 00:48:55.560 and we just interview each 00:48:55.560 --> 00:48:55.960 other. 00:48:55.960 --> 00:48:57.920 We go places and there's no 00:48:57.920 --> 00:48:58.960 sessions. 00:48:58.960 --> 00:49:00.900 Absolutely no structure to it 00:49:00.900 --> 00:49:01.960 whatsoever. 00:49:01.960 --> 00:49:05.960 And who's doing it? 00:49:05.960 --> 00:49:07.840 Alex Williams is doing it in 00:49:07.840 --> 00:49:10.100 Portland, Oregon sometime this 00:49:10.100 --> 00:49:10.960 summer. 00:49:10.960 --> 00:49:12.210 I don't know if he thought of 00:49:12.210 --> 00:49:12.960 it on his own. That's great. 00:49:12.960 --> 00:49:14.450 You know, there's another thing 00:49:14.450 --> 00:49:15.450 I want to fix about this 00:49:15.450 --> 00:49:16.960 business is that 00:49:16.960 --> 00:49:18.430 give people credit for their 00:49:18.430 --> 00:49:18.960 ideas. 00:49:18.960 --> 00:49:20.960 Come on. What's the problem? 00:49:20.960 --> 00:49:22.430 I know you feel the same way, 00:49:22.430 --> 00:49:22.960 right? 00:49:22.960 --> 00:49:23.960 Absolutely. 00:49:23.960 --> 00:49:24.960 You've been abused. 00:49:24.960 --> 00:49:26.630 Well, I don't like using that 00:49:26.630 --> 00:49:26.960 word. 00:49:26.960 --> 00:49:28.960 But I like pleading with people 00:49:28.960 --> 00:49:30.960 better than complaining. 00:49:30.960 --> 00:49:39.960 Anyway, okay, thanks everybody. 00:49:39.960 --> 00:49:41.960 We were about to be evacuated. 00:49:41.960 --> 00:49:43.440 This has been one of the most 00:49:43.440 --> 00:49:44.960 interesting podcasts ever. 00:49:44.960 --> 00:49:46.630 And I'd like to thank you all 00:49:46.630 --> 00:49:48.740 guys for coming by and see you 00:49:48.740 --> 00:49:49.960 all real soon. 00:49:49.960 --> 00:49:51.960 Thanks, Dave. 00:49:51.960 --> 00:49:55.710 This is a perfect way to end 00:49:55.710 --> 00:49:56.960 this. 00:49:56.960 --> 00:49:58.960 Are we going to kick it out? 00:49:58.960 --> 00:49:59.960 Hopefully we're alive still. 00:49:59.960 --> 00:50:01.960 Okay, that's it.